I received a phone call last night that I returned late this morning from an individual who lives near Graham Washington and is currently attending services with with NTCC and has been for quite a few years. What this person told me is really nothing new but it was nevertheless good to get it straight from yet another credible source.
This person was in conference when RWD paraded a minister who I believe was Devonshire in front of the entire congregation to flaunt his (available for a wife status). The individual who called me had remained alarmed for quite some time about the incident. This person thought that the escapade was totally inappropriate especially being that everyone knew the mans wife. This person also told me of additional occurrence that took place during a conference in Washington within approximately the last year when Kekel declared that it has never been a problem for an NTCC member to attend secular colleges or universities as long as the school didn't interfere with someones service to the Lord.
That is an outright lie for Kekel to make such a statement. Kekel is an outright liar and a crook. Anyone who might have even considered sending their child to a secular college would have been labeled as someone who didn't have their family in subjection and therefor wasn't qualified to lead a church if they couldn't lead their children to the NTCCs school of rules. I've heard that kind of stuff over and over again while attending NTCC services. It was also taught that if a person was soul winning, visiting people, having a full schedule of church services, praying and studying their bible, they wouldn't have time to attend a quote, "worldly secular college" and if they didn't understand that they needed to "get saved". It was taught by the NTCC leadership consisting of RWD, his overseers and his pastors that in the grand scheme of Gods eternal, spiritual agenda, (a worldly secular college) would be of virtually little or no "eternal" benefit what so ever. My recollection isn't vague but quite accurate and once again Kekel is deceitful.
The person I talked to also said that Kekel spoke of it never being a problem for people in the NTCC to be involved with organized sports and that from his chair next to the pulpit RWD piped in with, "quit saying Davis said". Apparently Kekel brought up the subject because people (rightfully so) had been complaining about Kekel's kid playing in all these high school sports while wearing shorts and tight football pants when they knew that RWD had verbally forbidden such conduct for years and years. So because people had been saying that they remembered RWD verbally stating his opposition to such sports participation, RWD decided to pipe in with "quit saying that Davis said". We all know that Davis and his pastors taught that sports participation and secular colleges were a waste of a Christians time and they would better serve God if they went, "soul winning", or went "visiting new potential converts", or went to "yet another church service", or "went into the ministry as a FULL TIME pastor" having previously attended the NTCCs school of rules otherwise know as the Bible college. Folks who didn't agreed with this stance heard over the pulpit that they "needed to get saved".
We all know these things were taught by RWD and his pastors and overseers and it is flat out INSULTING and INFURIATING for Kekel to suggest otherwise as though we all have poor recollection and memory or that we are all simply stupid while not possessing the mental capacity to read between the lines. I've concluded that all NTCC ministers (who sat through that conference and decided to stay with the NTCC) are inherently crooked because they must be after having listened to all that garbage while knowing it is was an outright lie.
Words can not express the degree of disdain that many of us now have for the NTCC leadership as a result of their deceitful, disingenuous and untruthful conduct. Kekel and RWD and Olson are outright liars and can in no wise be considered what the Bible refers to as "CHRISTIANS". Many, many people who heard this stuff preached, and who sat through NTCC services are my witnesses, and God himself is my witness for he knows what RWD and his pastors previously taught for decades. I stand behind this blog and boldly stand against the NTCC leaderships hypocrisy and I will gladly talk to anyone who contests my statements or anyone who also wants to discuss the NTCCs deceitful leadership.
Can anyone say,COMPROMISE! That is all there doing now. No matter what comes out of there very crooked lying mouths. They are COMPROMISER's. looks like rw davis is right in the thick of the Compromise. As long as he got his money. He does not care what Mike K. does to the organization.
ReplyDeleteThis same man that said after 25 years it is normal for a organization to start to crumble and compromise. I guess he was just warning us that is what was going to happen.
And we dummies took it as a warning not to let it happen! Stupid,stupid,naieve,gullable people we were!
More LIE's folks. Flea from this Organization and find a REAL Church. That loves you unconditionally,does not LIE to you,does not try and smear your good name,pit people against each other!!!
Those of us that LIVED it. Know that your BLOWING SMOKE Mike. And we got the notes to prove it!
As someone who was a minister in NTCC for 20 years, I can attest that what Jeff is saying is 100% correct. For all of my 20 years it was preached specifically that is was "worldly" and "ungodly" to play sports, have your kids play sports, have your kids in the school band (playing worldly music), and especially a SIN to attend a secular college!!!!!! Not only have thousands of us heard it in church and in Davis' classes, but many people still have it recorded in their notes-- double-spaced and in a clean, clear, plastic folder. (I threw mine out when I came to the realization that NTCC is not of God).
ReplyDeleteIt is not only completely hypocritical for Davis and Kekel to say "Davis never said it", or it wasn't a church policy-- IT IS AN OUTRIGHT LIE! And as Olson is so fond of saying, "All liars have their place in the lake of fire".
For those of you still in ntcc, I have no idea how you can keep following leaders like Davis, Kekel and Olson when they have LIED over and over again about past policies, and also continually LIED about those who have left. I thought LYING was a sin? I understand that some of you may have joined ntcc in the past few years, so the rules have changed considerably. But for those of us that were around for the past 20 years-- sports, band and college were sins punishable by hellfire.
NTCC is NOT of God. It is wolves in sheep's clothing. Angels' of darkness pretending to be angel's of light. If you think it is OK to follow men who constantly LIE then there is nothing I can do-- but why would you? Why don't you go to a REAL college and get a REAL minister's degree-- one that is actually worth something.
Jeff,
ReplyDeleteI was going to e-mail you this link cuz I thought it would make for a good blog post one day, but I couldn't find your e-mail address.
The link is called "5 warning signs of an unhealthy church". Interesting article..
http://www.newdaynews.com/files/5_warning_signs.htm
Take care :)
Jeff said...
ReplyDeleteIt was reported to me by this individual that Kekel declared that it has never been a problem in the NTCC for an individual to attend secular colleges or universities as long as the school didn't interfere with someones service to the Lord.
LTravis said...
Kekel says it's all good because he wants his son to attend the best college. I don't blame him and it should have always been permitted but IT WASN'T. Wake up people...
According to Kekel,
ReplyDeleteIt has never been a problem for your kids to play football
(Case study: Grant)
It has never been a problem attending bluegrass festivals where beer is served
(Case Study: Kekel)
It has never been a problem for indentured servants to clean one's house for free
(Case study Kekel)
It has never been a problem having the best car, the best house or the best diamond ring to wear
(Case study: Kekel family).
Mike Kekel might just be the best thing to ever happen to NTCC as far as allowing wordliness to creep into the church.
Folks attending NTCC right now never had it so good! Would they have attended 20 years ago? Half of them would NOT!!
it would not be so bad if this was taught from the beginning.
The only problem is, it was NOT!!
Not all of my experiences with NTCC were negative. I took an instant liking to Guyabera shirts, still like them as well as kimchi.
Bro Johnson the Young
More smoke and mirrors and damage control. I guess they know if they keep repeating a lie over and over people will believe it. I heard with my own ears when RW Davis declared that if our kids didn't go to the bible school, we were failures as parents. "Well, preacher," he said, "what about the call of God? Well, if you'd pray, God would call them." It was typical of his totally circular "reasoning" (like this gem: "I'm the nicest guy you ever met; if you don't believe it, just ask me!). We all got the message that any life work except minister/minister's wife for our progeny represented faulure.
ReplyDeleteJoe Rose was hounded from the pulpit when he decided to attend community college classes in St. Louis after he graduated from bible school. DAVIS SAID (and notice when he said "quit saying "Davis said," he didn't say that the allegations are at all untrue) that it was a total waste of time and would interfere with his walk with God. And when his campaign succeeded, he dragged Joe's name through the mud, bloviating about how the last time anyone saw Joe he had a cigarette in one hand and a beer in the other.
Kekel and Davis remember all this quite well, but such behavior has become incompatible with their agenda of luring unwary prey into the NTCC trap (they don't "win" souls; they trap them), now that the internet has opened a window into their formerly clandestine antics. So, they may say something never happened a million times, but there are still witnesses to the contrary that haven't been intimidated into silence. They want to reinvent their image, but until they deal with their sordid past, they'll never be authentic.
Yep, it's now no big deal at all for any of the ntcc "group leaders" to spend their days attending secular colleges & universities in the daytime. They attend these secular schools during the daytime while people in their congregation "think" they have a "full time" pastor.
ReplyDeleteI remember talking to one fella that is supposed to be a "full time" example to the flock and he was apprehensive about a "report paper" that he had to turn in. I asked him about it, thinking he had to turn in a pastors report,"wrong," he said it was some paper he had to get turned in
to the secular college he was going to.
He even would ask the folks, right there in church, to pray for him because he has a upcoming test at the secular college. This stuff was definitely frowned upon way back in the seventies and eighties. But if folks don't mind their pastor going to college as a "full time pastor" in the daytime, then keep pay'in up as much money as you possibly can! Colleges are not cheap!!!
"This stuff was definitely frowned upon way back in the seventies and eighties."
ReplyDeleteand also in the 90's and 00's. Another recent change?
Gregory
The other day my informant told me that Kinson shard form the pulpit that:
ReplyDelete"a certain brother came out of work and found that someone had replaced his car with a brand new one" and
"some of you would be filled with envy because God blessed him, I was shoutin with him"
Now first off, I would not believe a word that man spoke without confirmation.
I told my informant that and he said "why would he lie" typical ntcc mindless approach
The answer to that question is: because he is a man and a sinner and may be trying to manipulate people or embellish the truth
The Christian football movie "facing the Giants" had the exact same scenario, i wonder if the actor in the movie is the "brother" Kinson in referring to?
It may be true...but...it is obvious that Kinson is using the story to play against people questioning why the ntcc leaders are being "blessed by God" while everyone else is an incompetent fool!!!
Just another mind control tactic by the evil workers of NTCC
The empire is crumbling and they are scrambling to save as much money as they can get their greedy hands on.
Regards,
T
(I pray for the destruction of these false shepherds everyday- will you all join me??
Yes you are right Greg it was frowned upon in the 90's & 00's but I think I was trying to give them the benefit of the doubt.
ReplyDeleteHow about the double-mindedness that went on in 1994 when Roger came out & said if any preacher commited fornication or adultery then they would never again be allowed to preach in ntcc
& then turned around and changed that by-law the very next conference? & said that if any preacher commits fornication or adultery he will still be able to preach to others, but he will have to see the general board. He then said that God did not have us make the that rule anyway, it was us...
Dawn said...
ReplyDeleteThe link is called "5 warning signs of an unhealthy church".
Jeff said...
Thank you. That is very good information. Take care Dawn.
Jeff
Jeff, I have to disagree with you.
ReplyDeleteOne doesn't have to "read between the lines" to know exactly what NTCC teaches and expects. They preach what the (what they consider) damnable activities are in the clearest of terms.
They preach/teach on a subject (sports for example) from many different angles, using many different examples, using many different colorful analogies, for many decades. They publicly excoriate people who violate NTCC 'policy' from the pulpit at conferences, etc. It is impossible to misunderstand.
It's not our fault that the one in charge (Pastor Davis) has never missed God, doesn't remember the last time he sinned, and does all by the Holy Ghost.
Gregory
I understand Greg. You're absolutely right.
ReplyDeleteJeff
don't you just love that they all are buying into the lie's that Mike is spewing. There has been no change going on. Ntcc has always been like this. Bunch of crap!
ReplyDeleteAnd if we say any different. We are bitter,angry,of the devil. we have the proof in notes!! MANY of us sharing the EXACT same information. Folks that left ntcc in the eighties,nineties and now in the 2010!! We DO NOT have meetings to go over this information. Since leaving ntcc I have seen one person ONE TIME! And ntcc was mentioned and talked about for maybe ten minutes. They would rather not talk about the cult and anything to do with it. So we talked and laughed enjoyed each others company. WITHOUT talking about ntcc!
When many of us do get together it is to enjoy each other's friendship.
It is amazing how much more REAL,genuine a friendship with folks from ntcc but OUT of ntcc are. No suspucions about each other. No sneakiness of ratting each other out to gain BROWNIE points with the false teachers. No clouded,brainwashed life. We all looked the same,talked the same,a bunch of zombies we became! Life is so much more interesting. And NO,I have not become like the world!
So continue thinking,this man is telling me the truth. Though hundreds of us can testify that he and many of them are lying,twisted Gods word to make it work for them. There Not Gods church,Not Gods appointed shepherds for HIS sheep. Compare them to Amish,Catholics,UPC,Mormons. ALOT of similar attributes in ntcc and with these organizations. Ntcc considers these folks cults. And they do many of the samethings they do!!!
"If you don’t want fleas, don’t sleep with the dog! We’ve all been taught that if you want to reach your goals, you need to avoid negative people.
ReplyDeleteUnfortunately, it’s not that simple. There is poison everywhere, like a fog permeating our lives. We live in a world where everyone has an abundant supply of criticism and loves to hand it out for free."
ANON blogger on Mike's blog
If you make TRUE comments about ntcc. Then you Must be negative criticism! Folks sure put up big Blinders in ntcc. As if there is NO imperfections with ntcc. That it is 100% accurate,never do a thing wrong. What a fairy tale they live in.
While in ntcc you live in a bubble. You cut off contact with the world that is not ntcc. So all you know is ntcc and ntcc folks. Other friends are gone,you cut off your own blood family members. If they make a comment that is "negative" about ntcc. Then you must be unsaved and of the devil,right!
Folks,if you really allow God to get back inside your brain. Allow God to truley speak to you. That fog will lift and the blinders come down. You will be shocked at first. Like so many of us were. No way could we have been in a cult,or could we? takes some time to digest it all. Which is why as soon as you leave ntcc. Mentally you stay stuck in ntcc. Your brain is still in that fog. You may go to visit a church. And think there not up to par,or the false man made standards ntcc puts up as there "holiness". Like i said,takes some time to digest. Going on-line. Read,go to your Bible,read some more. pray and God will get your attention and open your mind back up.
I still am amazed at how close I am to God today then my upteen years in ntcc. I never felt God was there for me. Since whatever happened was decided by a man,not God! Now I have to rely ALL on God and no one else!
April
I was in that conference where davis paraded a married man, Devonshire, before all the congregation as if he were up for grabs for the women if they wanted him. Disgusting. davis did this because Christine wanted a baby. That was her 'sin'. She wanted a baby so davis was trying to break up their marriage and keep Devonshire from having kids, since children, in davis's own words, "hinder the work of the [org] Lord."
ReplyDeletekekel is lying flat out about ntcc preaching and teaching against going to any school but ntcc. kekel is lying and knows he is lying.
ntcc even taught against any job that was more than 9-5 because it would take one away from the [org] Lord.
ntcc taught against sports. We were there; and we know what was said and taught about sports and tight uniforms and all that kekel now lies and says never happened. kekel is a liar.
When the ruler hearkeneth unto lies, all his counsellors are wicked.
Guess what folks? ntcc is wicked. You know it. You WILL BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE FOR STAYING AND PROPAGATING THEIR LIES. It is wicked to be part of a group that lies so freely and you know it. You've been warned.
Jeff,
ReplyDeleteI was also in the conference when Devonshire was asked to stand up in front of the congregation and Davis made it known that he was available for dating. He was not...he was still married. I think it threw many of us into a state of mental confusion.
And if anyone in leadership in NTCC is claiming that it's always been allowed to attend college classes and whatever other doo-doo is proceeding from the mouth of Kekel...I would encourage everyone to check their Orientation notes and past conference notes and their Pastor's class notes and their Bible College notes...it's in there folks.
Kekel is lying for the sake of those IN, not for those who know the truth and can testify against them. IF this isn't proof for people who were in NTCC anytime during 2006 or before...then I don't know what is.
For crying out loud....Kekel denied me going to a puppet workshop when I had to ask permission to do so. This was for Children's Church. If you want further proof...go ask Darrin Butler...the one who relayed the message to me. Oh wait...he's not in NTCC any longer....hmmmmmmmmmmm....wonder why!?????
I don't think is all about compromise, maybe if you are with the house of prayer probably that is what your conclusion will be but I think is all about the organization changing but we won't know if these changes will be for the better of this org or what only after the death of rw, we will know for sure.
ReplyDeleteI've been made aware of people even now that have stated that when rw goes, they will go with olson because he is the most old fashioned of the bunch or closest to what the original ntcc was when it was started way back then.
I don't know if there will be a break or if kekel will boot olson up, because it was brought to my attention that rw in the conference told the audience that he wanted less work for olson and made a comment that he,rw, had to kind of force him to give up some of the work that he is doing for the sake of trying to not boggle him with so much work but it sounds as olson is getting prepared to just become more of a follower than anything else. They said that olson didn't have anything to do at all with the conference like the chairman of the board that he is. Who knows, maybe all is coming to a head. Somebody mentioned that alot of the ministers were missing and that some others were coming back from oversees like mcdonald.
In my days if you didn't make it to conference you were not walking in faith. Who was your God anyways if you can't trust in God to provide for you....so on and so forth, but anyways it is just one more episode in the saga that has been unfolding since the beginning of ntcc.
Olson is a crock. He is probably the worst 1 of the whole bunch. The guy cant make a decision. He knows exactly what is going on and he has no problem with it. I'd rather stay with Kekel. Olson is just a follower who has little or none of his own convictions. He simply steps to RWDs beat.
ReplyDeleteJeff
I wanted to say thanks to Tracy for saying that davis did make devonshire stand up so the ladies could ogle him while he was still a married man.
ReplyDeleteIn my original post I wrote that davis paraded devonshire. i could just see the ntcc spin meisters lying and saying, 'davis never "paraded" devonshire' and then thtowing out a look meant to imply that nothing was done. but davis did have devonshire stand up and did tell the ladies to look at this married man as if he were 'available'. But kekel loves to lie using half truths, like "we didnt "go there" trying to imply that nothing happened between him and tanya after he had already boasted to Vic about making out and pawing or groping her when she was between the ages of 14-16 and he was between 23 - 25. He's a predator and a liar. Just the facts, folks.
So, again, thanks Tracy. Wouldn't want to leave place for the ntcc spin meisters to 'chastise us for journalistic inaccuracies'... That would be such a calamity compared to child molestation that kekel and kinson are guilty of.
Ange
Tracy, or anyone, was it really the Darrin butler family that left ntcc? That's truly something. All those years in the office. Hmmnn. Very interesting.
ReplyDeleteAnge
Deb and I also were at the conference where Pastor Davis had Rev. Devonshire stand up in the service, telling the ladies to look at him, that Rev. Devonshire was available, a good catch, etc. David looked pleased as punch that Pastor Davis did this (no embarrassment, no reluctance, etc).
ReplyDeleteThe question we have always had (even back then) about this public incident is, was Rev. Devonshire even divorced at this time, or just separated?
We would like to assume he and Christine were divorced, but knowing NTCC as well as we do, you never know. It didn't seem there would have been enough time for the legal separation required by most states, and then divorce proceedings.
And what were the grounds for any potential divorce (again, was there enough time), that David was permitted to remarry whomever (lucky for Christine he ended up staying with her) by NTCC?
Deborah & Gregory
I am going to say with about 80% sure. that the Devonshire's WERE NOT divorced at the time of him being paraded around for the single ladies to get a good look at him.
ReplyDeleteWhile in Oceanside. I knew she wanted to have a baby. And he was not having any of that. Drove her to want to leave. But if she is like me. I stayed because of my love for my husband. You follow along. Do what is expected of you. Smile that fake smile. But deep down,you know that what goes on in ntcc is WRONG!
Hope maybe someday they will get to escape Together. Like me and my husband did and are still together!
April
Bro Jeff,
ReplyDeleteKekel admires you so much that he has changed the font on his personal web page (CEO Commentary) to look just like your web page!
Yet another fruitless attempt of him to grasp and claw his way to the top to try to out smart us all, but we are all to smart to be outsmarted by this old fox!!
If you can't beat them, join them! Ha Ha
I would not conceed victory just yet though.
Bro Johnson
Isn't that something. Other than the colors, there are some definite similarities. He changed his whole layout, (which now matches matches the Shunk's blog and this one).
ReplyDeleteI guess I could take it as a compliment? For all it's worth, I learned one thing from his blog as well that I now use, however it certainly wasn't his whole layout.
Either way. So it wouldn't seem so obvious he put his additional info on the left and this one has it on the right. He put his hit counter on the top and this one has it near the bottom. He did that deliberately so as not to make it so obvious that he was copying the layout used by the Shunk's and me.
The guy is fairly easy to figure out.
Cool observation Bro J.
Jeff
Just don't get the big head jeff, but I was just thinking of that conference when devonshire was made to "stand up" not "paraded" and there is a difference between the two. I know that k.j. was going around afterwards asking if we had seen christine, I guess she, christine, had made it to the conference for one day and maybe she was making the move to get back with her ex,other than that only the people involved in this situation know "if" they actually got divorced or just separated for awhile.
ReplyDeleteI also remember that same morning, rw was teaching about how spouses that leave will do it again if they be allowed to come back, and if they do it once they'll do it again. I supposed now that he was saying all these things to stop devonshire from taking her back, but now we know that it didn't work for him because he accepted her back and now they have a child, just like she wanted. We have alot of control on you men, and the ladies say: AMEN!
Now Mike moved his hit counter near the bottom. He didn't want you to be right Jeff.
ReplyDeletetime for a new thread!
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