Original thread posted on 3-6-09.
Thread #2 I posted a comment on Mike Kekel’s blog about two days ago. It has not shown up yet. Now with that being said I trust that Mike will post my comment when he gets a little free time. Just so you understand, the practice of blog moderation is similar to the practice of COMMUNISM where folks do not have the freedom of speech and or expression. Communistic governments do not want information spread freely because information empowers the public which is not the goal of a communistic country or state. Freedom of information and speech does not appear to be a goal of Mike Kekel either where his blog is concerned. Mike: We had a discussion on phone the other day and I respect your views regardless of whether or not I agreed with them. I hope you respect my views concerning this subject because I'm convinced they are valid.
I am creating this thread as a place for people to suggest topics that they desire to have started. I will try my best to start the topic within no more than one day from the date the suggestion is made.
I want everyone to understand that they have the liberty to assist me in building this blog. That is exactly why I am requesting suggestions for threat topics. It could be a very effective tool used to distribute information if folks would give me input, because I can use all the help I can get.
Update 6-21-2010: Over a year has gone by and my comment still hasn't been posted on Mike's blog. The spin doctor posts what benefits him and more specifically the NTCC and you can be certain that my comment would not benefit either.
Thank you
Jeff
22 comments:
I created this comment on Mike Kekels blog but he moderates what actually gets posted. I haven't seen it yet so I figured I would put it here.
NTCC folks on Mikes blog suggested that we are out of our minds because we feel that there is a double standard with the newfound acceptance of organized sports.
Throughout the years if I asked about playing organized sports I was told, "Does that help win more souls to Christ?" "I was also told playing sports is NOT soul winning" And “When you really get hold of God you won’t be interested in sports anymore because the Holy Spirit will put different desires in your heart.”
This is the kind of stuff that was stated by the NTCC leadership regularly. There were occasional games of volley ball or softball but NEVER involvement in organized sports for any reason because it would not have been accepted by the pastor. Where do you think all of these pastors got that stuff from? Did they all just dream it up? It came from RWD no doubt.
Then the lascivious business would always be brought up, especially if you wanted to wear tight fitting football pants. We all know that was the standard and it is no mystery so please don't insult my intelligence by suggesting that I or anyone else did not interpret the pastors guidance properly. We would be preached at and told that we weren't even SAVED if we had an interested in ORGANIZED sports vs. direct involvement in God so called programs set forth by the NTCC. You NTCC loyalists know what I have written is true.
Jeff.
eff,
I am in total agreement with you! Football uniforms are not exactly the most modest uniforms; and might I add here that the cheerleaders are not the most modest in dress either.
Diana Taylor
Sorry Jeff...I misspelled your name. You know what I meant.
My apology if this is off topic. The following statement came from Kekel’s blog site. I do not know this individual. These kind of statements are making me very upset. This whole kinder, gentler, and differences in opinion policy is ticking me off. I left the NTCC because they insisted on me being a robot. I will not be treated like you own me. A minister told me, Davis said, "We are no longer legislating righteousness." Who gave you the authority in the first place?
Can you say DOUBLE STANDARDS or COMPROMISE. Look at you guys now, computers,sports,and who knows what else. I can forgive but not forget. I have no problem with these things. The problem I have is you have condemned many people for things that are now acceptable.
I refuse to look at NTCC with rose colored glasses. Read Kees statement below carefully. WOW.
NTCC has cause a tremendous amount of damage. I think they owe many people an apology.
ro⋅bot
1. a machine that resembles a human and does mechanical, routine tasks on command.
2. a person who acts and responds in a mechanical, routine manner, usually subject to another's will; automaton.
Bro. A. Kees said...
this place of discussion is a blessing. i was telling Rev. Kekel it set me free on alot of things. GOD DIDN'T MAKE US ROBOTS. FREEDOM IN CHRIST. NOW THAT'S A BLESSING. LIBERTY IN CHRIST. I LIKE WHAT REV. KEKEL TOLD ME TONIGHT, DIFFERENCES IN OPINION, BUT GOING THE SAME DIRECTION. WHAT A BLESSING THIS PAGE IS TO ME AFTER ONLY READING IT TODAY BEFORE CHURCH. A. KEES
Thursday, March 12, 2009
Diana said.
I am in total agreement with you! Football uniforms are not exactly the most modest uniforms; and might I add here that the cheerleaders are not the most modest in dress either.
Jeff said...
Hey, it's good to hear from you. "eff" was close enough. Ha, ha. I knew what you meant. Wow, how have you been doing? I hope everything is going fine. We are going through some tough times as I am sure you know.
You are right. Those tight, butt hugging football pants and all showing cheer leading skirts don't leave much to the imagination for sure. It is a double standard and you and I both see that clearly.
Hey Diana, thanks for coming. Please continue.
Sincerely and Respectfully,
Jeff.
For all of you who don't know, I have known Diana Taylor of almost 25 years now. We go way back to the Ft. Hood Tx servicemen's home in 1985. A quarter of a century is a long time. Thanks again for coming Diana. It is somewhat humbling for you to be on this blog and I mean that sincerely.
Once again,
Jeff
L. Travis said...
A minister told me, Davis said, "We are no longer legislating righteousness." Who gave you the authority in the first place?
Jeff said...
Last time I checked it was RWD that gave them the authority. We all know that.
Larry: I understand your frustration because I feel the EXACT same way as you well know. You and I talk all the time and I feel your pain my friend.
These NTCC leaders are is being completely deceitful when they suggest that there hasn't been a change in the NTCC rules and standards. This stuff that is being permitted now was never accepted and any true, honest individual knows that Larry.
Your point is well taken.
Take care buddy,
Your friend,
Jeff
I wrote my message on Kekels blog about two weeks ago. Do you think he ever posted it? Of course not. Since I respectfully requested that he post my message, he has posted 9 other messages and conveniently left mine off.
Typical NTCC one-sided information flow. Just like the North Korean and Chinese Governments. Those governments censor all information and only allow certain information to ever get to the people.
I pulled this off the internet verbatim.
"Censorship in the People's Republic of China is the limiting or suppressing of the publishing, dissemination, and viewing of certain information in the People's Republic of China (PRC). The majority of such censorship is implemented or mandated by the PRC's ruling party, the Communist Party of China"
Tell me that doesn't describe the NTCC. NTCC translation:
"Censorship in the New Testament Christian Church is the limiting or suppressing of the publishing, dissemination, and viewing of certain information that come from blogs other than Mike Kekels or from people other than the ones that Mike allows to post on his blog. The majority of such censorship is implemented or mandated by the NTCC's ruling party, the Communist Party found in the Davis and Kekel households.
I am not trying to be funny either. It's sad and true.
When my wife and I left the church in Atlanta because of the ramped abuse instituted by Mayers, we were ordered to have no contact with anyone in Mayers church. They didn’t even want us to send baby pictures to a brother and sister that was still there. They wanted our voices shut so others wouldn't find out how crooked and abusive Mayers was and still is. All the folks found out anyway by having to deal with Mayers.
Jeff.
I left a post on his blog too, questioning his use of the word immodest, when it came to the uniforms worn by football players. Nope, he still hasn't posted it. I seriously doubt he will. I personally think some of the words they use, like modesty, are subjective - to them it means long uncut hair, dresses, etc. To me, it means that I don't dress in a way that emphasizes any part of my body in a way that causes others to stare at that particular part of my body. Does that mean I wear a full skirt or baggy dress? Not necessarily... but it does mean I don't wear thigh hugging jeans and body clinging t-shirts.
I know Diana! I've been trying to contemplate how to find you, but can't find you on myspace or facebook! I have so much to tell you! e-mail me lukem2006@gmail.com
Ok I posted something over on Not New Testament Christian Church. And since I just found your blog today from a link that Tracy so kindly posted.
a topic.
Tithing of your Tax return after you already tithed off your gross income. Heard it said a few times when it was tax season "don't forget to tithe off your tax return or your robbing God!"
Thats tithing twice FYI. If you tithed off your gross income (what you would have recieved before the government took their percentage) you don't need to tithe off your tax return.
I never tithed off my Tax return cuz Daddy didn't raise a fool. I knew that I had already tithed off my taxes when I tithed off my gross income. I was raised in church. I was saved before NTCC (they did try to get my "saved" for about 3 months until I finally said "I am already saved stop bugging me to get saved!")I still hate that I let NTCC suck me in. But I was going through a rough time when I was invited and started going. I did meet some awesome people who I still am in contact with (who have also left) also I still talk to some that are still in. I haven't tried to convince them to leave because they will leave when God opens their eyes. So I just pray for them. If they ask me why I left I answer truthfully. And I know God let it happen for a reason.
I was in for 3 years. I know not as long as others but trust me I left feeling worse about myself then I did going in.
But that just bugs me telling people that they have to tithe off their tax return or they are robbing God. When they were not robbing God if they did not tithe off their tax return.
I personally think Tithe should be used to support the pastor of that specific church, be used to help the community either in giving of food or clothing or help paying bills etc. Which I never saw happen. And when we went through a period we needed help (my husband did not get paid for 2 months). I asked for help and I even told the pastor we would repay the church once my husbands pay kicked in and I got the ol... Well I need to ask Pastor Davis. And then the answer was NO. So I had to go down to the local DSHS office to get help. And ask family and friends for help. Because my church was too stingy to help. When I say I am going to pay someone back money I borrowed. I pay it back. But I guess that wasn't good enough for them. I didn't just want a free handout. I offered if they helped to give the full amount back to the church as soon as my husband started getting his pay. All I asked for help with from NTCC was paying rent.
Which was $650.00
There are a lot of good people in NTCC. I miss a bunch of them. I did learn some things I wasn't taught growing up. Which I still practice. But the emotional and spiritual damage I was dealt wasn't worth the price of staying. I may have been physically attending for 3 years but the year before I left I was mentally out. I would go to church and totally space out during the preaching. Not hearing a word that was said. I stopped going soul winning and I stopped helping in the nursery. ETC. I had my reasons for staying longer then I did and I told no one I was leaving when I did leave. They found out when they went to my apartment and it was empty that I was long gone. I literally was in another state by the time they realized I was gone. Physically I was in for 3 years. Mentally I left NTCC the year before I physically left. One day I'll have to share with you Jeff.
But I am not going to post my contact information here. Last time I did something like that I had 20 people emailing me that were still in NTCC flaming me. Only one person apolojized and I accept it. But it took me a while to get over the hurt. TO be able to trust another pastor again, etc.
I always pray and ask God to either get rid of the jerks in NTCC that cause the problems and make it into a true Church after the Heart of God. Or shut it down completely so that more people are not mentally and spiritually damaged. Because that damage is harder to get over then physical damage is. I still deal with things but for the most part I am me again.
We are not the one's having Pepsi with the Devil.
Davis is. A true Christian would reach out to the community and help it. A True Christian would love their members even if they fail at something. He would encourage them not tear them down. ETC.
Luke 6:45 (NIV) The good man brings good things out of the good stored up in his heart, and the evil man brings evil things out of the evil stored up in his heart. For out of the overflow of his heart his mouth speaks.
Idaho Angie,
Thanks for sharing with us. I was a minister in ntcc for 20 years-- but was not manipulative or abusive-- which is why I never put in a leadership position. Jeff knows me pretty good. I'm thinking about writing some pieces for this blog-- one of which will be the psychological reasons we stay in an abusive, cultish enviroment. Trust me, I despise myself sometimes for staying in as long as I did. Ntcc is an abusive, evil church that needs to be stopped.
As for tithing on tax returns-- yes, I heard it many times. In typical ntcc fashion they would "hint" that you should do it (to make God happy or be extra blessed, etc). It was all rubbish. I think I only did it once, but since I was in poverty almost my entire stay in ntcc, I couldn't afford to double-tithe-- I needed my tax money to pay bills. But what usually happened was we used our tax money to fund another trip to conference, which was an intense hardship for the majority of people. Ntcc leaders have proven over and over that they are just greedy, selfish people who manipulate people for their own gain.
Angie said...
Tithing of your Tax return after you already tithed off your gross income. Heard it said a few times when it was tax season "don't forget to tithe off your tax return or your robbing God!"
Thats tithing twice FYI. If you tithed off your gross income (what you would have recieved before the government took their percentage) you don't need to tithe off your tax return.
Jeff said...
Angie; great post. Believe it or not I almost pulled this exact post off Tracy's blog to repost it on the home page. That just shows how greedy and crooked these folks are. My wife and I experienced the same thing from a pastor that said to tithe on the tax return and that wan't the first time I heard that out of and NTCC minister. What a farce.
On a different subject. I noticed that Casey replied to you and he mentioned that I know him. Casey is one of the most good natured and credible people that I have ever met. It is truly sad how the NTCC treated that man. Like Casey said; he was a minister in the NTCC for a long time and guys like Casey and Victor Johanson had to leave the NTCC because they were good ministers and more importantly good people.
They couldn't abuse people like some of these other NTCC ministers do regularly.
Jeff.
Two things to address here:
1. I like what Jeff states, that he will pull statements that are not true about "the" ntcc, as he would say. This should not be a free-for-all puke box, but hopefully will be somewhat constructive.
2. Don't expect your comments on MCK's blog site to be posted, unless it's a "praise God", "We're winning Sir"..."You go guy" type of stuff. I also wrote something in the comment section of his blog concerning why people would want to post anon, and it has yet to be posted.
To avoid it being a witch hunt, for those still in who disagree.
I hate to even write this, but he has proven himself, via the ministers group, that if you bring weighty matters to the table, they will be written off as having the wrong spirit, attacking Pastor, etc, therefore, they will not be posted.
Just something to keep in mind when commenting, even constructively on MCK's blog.
Bro Jeff,
Just wanted to report that the Official NTCC site is down, repeat, is down. When you type it up, you are referred to "Go Daddy.com"
Interesting, what is Kekel up to now??
Bro Johnson
The spin doctor is always up to something. Who knows.
Jeff
I recently have met a friend who has escaped the persecution of the cult you are referring to. The damage done by those idolators is horrible. To let an organization like this prey on our young soldiers or anyone is a crime and now lets shine Jesus's light on them and watch them scatter into the darkness like the foul vermin they are!!!
"JF" can you elaberate, over?
BTW NTCC Web Site is back up, no new changes, I guess NTCC did not pay the Bill for the month?
HA HA
Bro Johnson
I'm glad that somehow repetition washes your brain. God bless you, MCK
Oops I think Mike left out part of a work. ntcc repetition BRAINWASHES your brain. Puts you under there fog. Where you begin to let them do your thinking for you! We All let them. Those of that are now Free. Finally let the fog lift. And whola,you realize how messed up ntcc really is.
April
My friend is so damaged, she can't function in society, She was a soldier of the year canidate and they Killed her husband and took everything from here, I tried to get her help, but due to a recent dispute between us she is not receiveing my counsel.
CALL TO ARMS MY BROTHERS AND SISTERS, CALL SOMEONE GET THE WORD OUT ON THESE IDOLATORS, GET A HOLD OF STARS AND STRIPES, YOU CLOSEST MILITARY POST, VETERANS, AMERICAN LEGION, YOUR CONGRESSMAN, ANY REPORTER, HELP OUR SOLDIERS PLEASE, THEY PUT IT OUT THERE FOR YOU, LETS BACK THEM UP. DON'T LET THIS NTCC TRASH HURT ANYMORE OF THEM
Jeff,
It took me 27 years to realize that I was in a cult. I can't help but wonder how many people just like me are still trapped and don't even realize it. 13 years under 14 different pastors, many of which preached not only the word of God but thier own doctrine of mind control. I am very much ashamed to have been a part of ntcc for so many years. It's amazing how they can get away with preaching the doctrine of "Isolation" that introduces standards more strict and way more intrusive than any holiness preaching that can be extracted out of the bible. I was never in bibleschool but every thing I heard was filtered down from the upper echelon to the RWD wannabies that would add to or take away from the word of truth as they saw fit for thier own purposes. Here are a few of the teachings that came across the pulpit:
1. You must look like a dork to be a christian. ie... wingtips, polyester slacks and white shirts.
Jeans were preached against and t-shirts, short sleeve shirts that would cling.
2. No facial hair. A mustache was a feature that represented crookedness. A beard was out of the question.
3. The "devilvision" which now is being used to advertise by ntcc was a devise concieved by the devil himself.
4. Pride was anyone who disagreed with anything being preached by ntcc ministers no matter how outlandish and unscriptural it was.
5. Gum was preached against. It was a sin to chew gum.
6. Church hopping was a sin. I wish now I would have hopped on out of that cult the first chance I got.
7. Any kind of music not approved by ntcc was a sin to listen to. Even Christian music that was not ntcc approved.
8. If you had anykind of religious t-shirt or bumpersticker or christian fish, you were preached against for having a bumpersticker religion. If you wore a cross or a shirt with a picture of a cross you would be asked the question, "What if Jesus died in an electric chair would you wear one of those around your neck"?
Do you get the picture here? It wasn't just about separating yourself from the world, but it was about self righteousness to the point of total and complete mind control. If you can be made to look and act like a complete dork, and sent out into the world to convert other dorks into this isolated life style then you could be manipulated into giving tens of thousands of dollars to the ntcc over a period of time. This is what I did. I gave willingly until it hurt. Never had anything but poured money into the "work of the Lord" so that others could be brainwashed like I was while the Elite live in thier mansions and drive thier expensive cars and motor homes.
I think that God abhors very much of what is going on in ntcc. A few weeks ago I seen blogs like this and thought that they were hate groups that were blaspheming the church, but God has allowed me to see that in ntcc there is a critical judgemental attitude that cuts people up into pieces and uses them until they have nothing left and then throws them under the bus. I now think it is important that ntcc be called on some of thier outrages teachings and it is important that our voices be heard so that the many people that are being destroyed can know that God still loves them very much inspite of how they are made to feel by ntcc. I am not afraid to speak out against them. They were and are not afraid to preach false doctrine so why should we be afraid to call them out?
Don Tumioli
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