Lots of good stuff came out in the last thread. The NTCC is in conference I guess. It's that time of the year for some more good old fashioned brainwashing. I'm glad I'm not there. I wasted enough vacation time and money on that nonsense just to listen to old RDouble Cross Davis tell everyone where they could find the door if they didn't like it in his church. I had to listen to him tell everyone how great Kekel was while bragging on Barnes and Denis.
We know what happened to those two and if Barnes and Denis are any indication of the quality of RWDs judgment, you know what you are getting with Kekel. Barnes basically ran off with his whole church (minus one or two) and Denis tried to run off with the entire NTCC and partly succeeded. Kekel doesn't have to run off because first, he is not black, and second, the NTCC/RWD is giving him more than enough money. Denis and Barnes ran off because they didn't feel like they were getting their fair share and Denis said the NTCC was full of racism and frankly he was right.
They used to throw the "N" word around like it was candy and tell enough racist jokes to make me sick. Well, there you have it. Write whatever you'd like. The NTCC is still a control freak organization full of narcissists, nepotism, and men pleasers.
Good night.
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I can't believe I gave $1000 for that Camp Ground pledge back in 2002. SMH O well that's not as bad as what some others gave.
Once again, join the club. I gave entirely too much money to that organization as well and I'm sure I also gave in 2002. I was at that conference. Davis stood up there (starting with himself) naming each person who gave, one by one and indicating the dollar amounts. Boy that was more brainwashing. "Look what I gave"!!! Did everyone hear that I gave $500?!!! Did you hear that Brother so and so gave $900?!!! Wow!
Did you hear how much pastor Davis said that "he" gave?!!!! $5000!!!! Boy isn't pastor Davis a good example of someone who knows how to sacrifice for the program of Gawd. Boy pastor Davis sure is good at giving money back to himself.
I think I need to make a $5000 pledge to myself for my own home improvements. Davis always says the NTCC is "his" organization and my house is mine so that sounds about right to me. Boy Davis sure knows how to sacrifice.
And did you know that Davis said that he can't remember the last time he sinned, and everything he does is by the direction of the Holy Ghost? Boy I wish I could be that spiritual. Isn't Kekel, Barnes and Denis great? pastor Davis said so and therefor that must be the case because everything he does is by the direction of Gawd. Do you think maybe that Gawd missed something with Barnes and Denis? I mean, I was just thinking, (which is something that many people don't do in the NTCC). Gawd told RWD to tell everyone that Denis is and Barnes are great but once again I was thinking. Didn't they both double cross Davis and leave RWD's organization and take as many people as they could take with them?
Oh thats right. Gawd directed that by secretly keeping it from pastor Davis because Gawd knew that he had to purge his holy organization of all those compromisers. Thats what Olson said and I know Olson is a humble man of Gawd because Davis said that Olson is the most humble man of Gawd he's ever known so that all has to be the truth. Praise Gawd, Gawd sure does know how to take care of the NTCC.
Well, conference is under way! By now, everyone has read the rules of the campground and dutifully signed the pledge sheet to abide by the rules. They've heard the rules from the pulpit as the most righteous, pure as the wind driven snow, apologizing to the holy ghost when he passes gas, Rev. J H Olson recites them with great emphases on certain parts. and let us not forget, they've all been shown the door by the most powerful man to ever live, the "crookster" himself, R W Davis.
Yes, my friends, this will be the best conference of all time! Just ask them, they'll tell you. So, let us buckle in for what is surely going to be the best move of Gawd on the planet ever! Yippee!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Since the Org has taken a hit with attendance I wonder if business is booming in Mexico. I bet they can tell the Org is dying!!
We pledged $2,000, and paid it.
Gregory & Deborah
I am soooo glad I am not at conference!!!! But I am definitely looking forward to flying out to visit MY family for thanksgiving...something I NEVER got to do while in NTCC.
I am so glad that I am not staying in a room on camp! It was said, "What a blessing to be able to stay on camp"...but in reality, it was moldy, cold/hot (depending on the season), and there were always dead bugs laying around by the time we got there. I would get sick just about every time we stayed.
One would think, how strict they are with cleaning the house/dorms/church/etc, the campground would be kept up a little better. My first pastor even "harassed" me for having a dusty house...and I was in the military, working, at that time! Give me a break! No mercy for others, but we have to overlook their hypocrisies.
What about all the leaders that get there early, instead of eating and talking about everybody, maybe helping to get the rooms ready for those that will be staying and paying to help "support" the camp ground!
But, no, of course not.
Did I say I am so glad I am not going?!!!
I'm also so glad I'm not in conference Double Ugh. Listening to RWD and Kekel give all their great ideas because they are so spiritual and Olson putting us to sleep. I'd rather sleep in my front yard in a pup tent. Kekel things he's God's authority on spirituality and he's anything but. I couldn't believe what he wrote to Bro Bellamy. Kekel is such high minded blow hard. He is really a poor example of a Christian/decent person.
Chief said "Kekel is such high minded blow hard. He is really a poor example of a Christian/decent person".
And let us not forget...he's a PATHETIC BASTARD!!!
Ain't that the truth. You better believe that dude is pathetic.
In my 13+ years, I never attended a conference, Members are exempt from being required, so what happens at the conferences anyway. I have read some things here, but it doesn't sound like a fun week in any way shape or form. I am glad I never used my vacation for this "christian fellowship". So basically, its's all about asking for money? and what else?
Well in all fairness, it's not a bad time. In fact it can be a lot of fun because you see a lot of people you haven't seen for a year or more. Plus, between services, (which is quite a bit of time) you can do some sight seeing and there is plenty to see in that area.
Now, about the church services. Certainly RWD does his share of orating and my view now is somewhat different than it was then. Sure I could see right through certain things said but not nearly as well as I can now. They put good effort into getting people emotional and all stirred up with the different song services which include people singing solos like Ashmore and Tanya. Because there are no real miraculous or divine appearances by God in any shape form or fashion, the intent is to get everyone all worked up singing and jumping around. The NTCC equates that to the "moving of God".
Of course they make reference to the Ark coming and David dancing in 1Ch 15:29 to justify that stance and it's the same old song and dance (pun intended) every single solitary time. Folks jump up and down and bounce off each other and when people are real happy, they take up pledges and on occasion they announce the names of every single person who pledged and the amount. Davis blasts everyone but primarily the ministers, and talks about how great certain ministers are. The ones who Davis highlights the most, more than not, wind up leaving the NTCC for good.
Davis tell jokes, talks about fat women, tell how great certain people are doing, and does his best to get people more motivated to go back to their churches and do "more" soul snatching/soul winning. Davis talks about himself a lot and tells all his "Christian war stories" in an attempt to make people think his is some kind of great prophet of God. And after Davis dogs people out, he says he has a message from God......... And then the suspense comes.......... Davis says that God told him to tell everyone that God loves them and I am not exaggerating and I kid you not. I specifically remember Davis doing that.
Well eventually Davis gave into the pressure and started allowing plays with scenery/entertainment. The NTCC sure did change their tune on that one because once upon a time, all that stuff was considered compromise and worldliness. Now I guess they are having cook outs with frisbees and such.
Anyway, conference could be a good time but I lost patience for the antics, shenanigans and brainwashing.
Chief said...
In fact it can be a lot of fun because you see a lot of people you haven't seen for a year or more.
Chief responded to himself...
Yes you do see people that you haven't seen for a while but very few of them are your real friends anyway unless you remain a part of the NTCC. The NTCC does not bring people together, it pits people against each other. If you don't expose the NTCC after you leave (like I do), your old NTCC friends want to "pray" for you like you are the one who is lost just because you left. If you do expose the NTCC (like I do), they see you as a "hater", "devil", or "bitter". So basically they either feel sorry for you or they see you as the enemy. Well I'm not looking for any sympathy, and the last place that I'm interested in ever going is back to the NTCC.
There are some but only few exceptions to that rule. The exceptions usually don't stay with the NTCC too long after because they understand why you left and they know you had valid reasons.
So yes, at conference you see old "associates", but they are not people that I would generally refer to as genuine friends. So consequently, I don't miss conference. If I want to sight-see, I can go on my own without having to listen to RWD, Kekel, or Olson blowing no more than hot air.
I also always liked conference (after we figured out a way to afford to get there). It was a great time, especially when we started always staying in the Lodge for the few years before we stopped going.
Staying in the Lodge was good because people hung out real late, and there was always something going on. If you stayed on the Campground, and you weren't in the Lodge, when fellowship at the Hall was over you had to go back to your rooms (no visiting).
Plus, the Lodge had a kitchen and refrigerator you could use for snacks/meals.
Plus, Conference was the only "vacation" that was ever authorized.
Gregory
The Lodge was like the Big House on a plantation; every so often Massa Davis would let the field hands get a gander of how the elites lived. No cold water showers, open latrines, or fellowship curfews for them. Then we got to go back down to our ramshackle huts with the 2x4 beds and concrete floors and dream about how Gawd would bless us if we just "stayed faithful" and kept sucking up to the hierarchy.
Yeah, right. The blessings didn't start for me until I beat feat away from that corrupt bunch of grifters. Seems to be the common trajectory, too--leave, get blessed. Kind of like night following day.
How about it--anyone out there who has left NTCC and is doing worse? So far I haven't met anyone like that.
DS or GS said..."Plus, Conference was the only "vacation" that was ever authorized".
Yah, that's true for the "little people" but, not for them hypocrite overseers. Whenever they're on the road it's one big fat vacation filled with shopping spree's and the like. When they come to the churches they slip up and reveal their visits with families and places they go in between their so-called revivals. I used to hate those stupid, so-called revivals, because they were nothing more than spy trips for Davis. Tieman's so-called revival's were equivalent to drinking a whole bottle of vinegar. That duffis couldn't preach his way out of a wet paper bag if it was ripped open. Not to mention his retarded acting wife in service's running to the front of the church, not wearing pantyhose, dancing and jumping around feigning a move of the Spirit. Really, she was just trying to cover up the sorriness of her husbands sermon.
Since we left my wife and I have been on three vacations and there are plenty more to come.
Thank God for deliverance from that stupid Org. Bunch of PHONY HYPOCRITES!!
Now they just throw rape jokes around like there candy
I take it you've been to conference. Is that where the rape jokes are being told?
Well, somebodies got to say it, I guess it will be me. Edward came on here, stirred things up with the Kekel letter and then runs away because he's convicted now. Edward, may I suggest the next time that you decide to do something...please pray about it first. it works out a whole lot better, for everybody!
I'm sure Kekel and the boyz had fun this week with your posting and then running away because of your walk with God. Please establish that walk a little closer before you do something, not after. thanx for listening...this has been a public broadcasting message brought to by Jeff's blog.
conferences were kind of a place where you see the "who's who" of the org.
If you didn't belong to the "clicks" you were out!
People were friendly enough but from afar off.
I remember trying to get to the front and the ladies giving you that look of, "who do you think you are trying to get a front seat?" because if you were on the back you could never hear anything, that sound system was forever muffled.
Then it was the frenzy to find out where the board members were going to eat so they could go there too and maybe catch a glimpse of glory!
Edward, may I suggest the next time that you decide to do something...please pray about it first....
I don't think praying about it is the right approach. Knowing what you know and sticking by it is the right approach. Chief said he's not backing up for anybody and thats the approach that Edward should take. The ntcc is still in Edwards head. He hasn't totally shook them off yet. Yes Edward did say that he told the truth but that was after he apologized. There was no need for an apology. It made him seem weak and unsure of himself.
Fortunately, Brill stuck his foot in his own mouth so many times, that it became obvious that Edward had written the truth in the first place.
Brill coming on here to defend himself certainly didn't help his cause. Brill inflicted more damage to his cause.
Anonymous said...
Well, somebodies got to say it, I guess it will be me. Edward came on here, stirred things up with the Kekel letter and then runs away because he's convicted now. Edward, may I suggest the next time that you decide to do something...please pray about it first. it works out a whole lot better, for everybody!
I'm sure Kekel and the boyz had fun this week with your posting and then running away because of your walk with God. Please establish that walk a little closer before you do something, not after. thanx for listening...this has been a public broadcasting message brought to by Jeff's blog.
Edward said...
I have already explained myself and my actions and why I am trying not to post and conviction is not one of them. It seems to me that you are either trying to provoke me to continue posting with your childish comment or you are an Amateur manipulator and need to return to the NTCC for further training.
I could call you a COWARD for posting under Anonymous. You have your reasons and I will not insult you or question your motives.
You do seem to still have one thing in common with NTCC and that is your Pharisaical way of questioning one's closeness with God by your hypocritical standards.
BTW stupid, I mean anonymous, I already said I should have prayed before I posted. Maybe everyone else read what I actual said and that is why they didn't say anything.
May I suggest you engage your brain before posting?
Rapid Ed Bellamy
Are you guys stupid or what?
READ what I said with your BRAIN engaged please. I apologized to Bro. Brill, Not NTCC or Rev. Kekel, because Bro. Brill IS a friend and he may have asked me not to say anything, but I couldn't remember.
I could care less what NTCC thinks, but if I give my word to someone then I do everything I can to keep it.
People like you do more harm to what Jeff and many others are trying to accomplish. When people from NTCC read your stupid comments and see how you didn't take the time to read what was said before jumping to your WRONG conclusion they say the entire blog is a lie and Rev. Kekel is right.
Please read and think first.
Rapid Ed Bellamy
Yes sir, but the only thing is that brill should know that if he doesn't want something to be told than why open his mouth in the first place?
Once you say something to somebody it is most likely to be told again, so brill should have just kept quiet about it and let things be.
On another note about what brill said:
I read carefully what he got to say and one thing I found out is that tk and vd were the ones to fix him up with regina, that my bruther, is kind of insulting.
Even if it didn't happened that way, I read it and it came across that he was just working around the davises and kekels houses and low and behold tk and vd thought he would be a good match to olson's daughter.
Everything that brill wrote was kind of weird to begin with, the way he addressed you "bruther" and to save him some "chicken"
Anyways,
You are a good man and I have fond memories of you and your wife, have a good life.
Anonymous said...
Everythng that brill wrote was kind of weird to begin with, the way he addressed you "bruther" and to save him some "chicken"
Edward said...
Don't think much of those statements. They were inside jokes that he knew I would know what they meant.
You seem to know me; email me at ebb702@yahoo.com
Bro. Bellamy
Also, you have to understand that all of this happened almost 2 years ago. I still don't know why Rev. Kekel emailed me after so long a time.
Bro. Bellamy
Because Kekel sees you as being beneath him. The way he addresses you was like you are one of his children. Very condescending. Basically he was chewing you out like you lecture a child. He clearly sees himself as being superior to you. It's obvious when you read his writing. I suspect you entertained his advise while you were with the NTCC because he sees himself as someone who you should naturally take advice and admonition from.
Chief
Kekel can kiss my butt.
Not really. This is the way that he talks to everyone. He even emailed me back and said that he didn't see anything arrogant and degrading about his statements. What is so amazing is that he can't see how rude and degrading he is.
He sees everyone as beneath him; that is just how he is.
I could have emailed him back, but I decided what is the point? Stupid is as Stupid does.
I still may answer a few of his question about my dedication to God and what I have done for God.
Bro. Bellamy
Chief wrote..."Because Kekel sees you as being beneath him."
I know I am beneath Senior Pastor Kekel.
I am beneath him in prevarication, double-speak, hypocrisy, arrogance, back-peddling, self-justification, calling (based on my testimony…my calling is to pastor, preach, teach, and pioneer churches and seminaries out in the field), politicking, flip-flopping, a sense of self entitlement, misinformation, playing favorites, willful ignorance, seething, undermining, discord sowing, etc.
So, he can talk down to me any time he wants. He has earned that right after his 28 years of sacrifice in Graham.
Gregory
Edward said...
I still may answer a few of his question about my dedication to God and what I have done for God.
Chief said...
For what it's worth, I wouldn't. My dedication to God or the lack thereof is none of his business. Kekel is not my judge so I wouldn't answer any of his questions on that subject. That is between me and God. The fact is, I owe no one on this earth an explanation about what I've done for God. Even deeper than that, and being quite realistic, I don't know exactly what I've done for God and no one else does either. What I do know is this:
Mat 25:37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?
38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?
39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?
40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
That may be the answer to the question concerning what anyone of us has ever done for God.
Kekel wouldn't get an answer on that one nor does he deserve one. Kekel needs to ask himself that question. Anyone can stand up in front of a bunch of people and blast them and spew out a bunch of rules.
Anonymous said...
Hit a nerve, did I? I guess we need to work on that touchiness a little. Huh???
Chief said...
Here is hitting a nerve for you. Delete. Apparently you were confused when you thought this was harass Edward day because it's not. We may go about things differently but Edward is a friend and a good hearted dude.
"Hit a nerve"? "A bit of touchiness?"
Whoever you are anonymous, you are making yourself sound really stupid to all of us, and I'm sure many would agree. You want to come on here with your "holier than thou" attitude and judge Bro Bellamy and tell him what he needs to work on...
Why don't you take your own advice!?!
We can all see through you and your attempt to get Bro Bellamy to stop writing here.
I am not sure if you are still with NTCC, but I assume you are; you do know that they preach against coming on these blogs, don't you. Or have they changed that.
Davis would say numerous times that if you come on here, you need to get saved. So, who's side are you on?
IT was more than admonishment that you offered him, it was fault finding.
You said,
"Well, somebodies got to say it, I guess it will be me. Edward came on here, stirred things up with the Kekel letter and then runs away because he's convicted now. Edward, may I suggest the next time that you decide to do something...please pray about it first. it works out a whole lot better, for everybody!"
Actually, no one had to say it, and probably most of us were not even thinking what you were. We are on Bro Bellamy's side and have gone through similar things that he has gone through, especially putting up with Kekel's lies and junk.
You said he ran away because he was convicted and should pray next time.
Why don't you take your own advice anonymous and pray before you find fault with a brother. HE did not run away but made a decision on his part, which all of us are allowed to make: our own decision. WE are out of NTCC now and do not have to think the way you tell us to think. WE do not have to do what you tell us to do. So, why don't you take your own advice, as I said before, before you come on here blasting Bellamy.
I'm not sure if you emailed him like he asked you to, I haven't even revealed myself yet...but the right thing to do, if you were so concerned about him praying, would be to talk to him directly. You make yourself to be a fool coming on this blog the way you did.
Can I hear an Amen?
Yeah, the whole "what I've done for God" line is so presumptuous. Even Paul said he didn't judge himself, and he admonished us to judge nothing before the time. I submit that the people who think they've "done something for God" have probably done the least. But they love asking "what are you doing for God." I'm much more interested in sharing what God has done for me.
Vic said " But they love asking "what are you doing for God."
Davis and Kekel love saying this about those who have left the org. It reveals what they are all about...WORKS! Thank God for His GRACE.
haha, Cheif, we both posted at the same time to that person!
I won't mind if you delete mine too since i quoted some of his stuff. either way, we both feel the same!
Gotta love you!!!
Yes we did.
Double Ugh,
Your comment is absolutely fine and I agree with what you wrote. Whoever this person is, they are absolutely targeting Bro Bellamy with intent and I have a few ideas who that individual might be. However, there is no way I could know for certain and really it doesn't matter. The NTCC has their bully pulpits and on occasion, this one is mine and that is where the delete bottom comes in. It's all good. Later Double Ugh and I appreciate ya.
Oh, when I put my screen name in "Chief", it reminded me of where I was at yesterday evening. I have a close friend who also used to be in the NTCC in the same church as I. Well he is stationed here at Ft. Benning and he is now a Chief Warrant Officer. He is doing very, very well for himself. I went to his house yesterday evening and his house is the nicest house that I've ever been in which belongs to someone who I personally know. Absolutely beautiful. It's a brick house that is pushing nearly 6000 sq feet. Hard wood and or tile floors throughout the first floor and I could go on and on. He has the nicest dinning room set that I've ever seen in my entire life and I'm not exaggerating.
The point to all this is many, if not all who have left the NTCC are doing very well for themselves. My friend's house previously belonged to a Doctor. The house was a bank foreclosure and my buddy scooped it up for nearly half it's appraised value. Three stories above ground.
So who would have ever known that a guy who was a Private only 12 years ago and who left the NTCC about 4 years ago, would now be living in such a spectacular house while enjoying such prosperity? The NTCC is a system which fosters failure and poverty for the masses, and the people who have left the NTCC are experiencing the exact opposite. It is so nice to see my friend and his family doing so well and he will likely retire as a CW4 or CW5 with great pay and benefits.
People, do yourselves a favor. Leave the NTCC and whatever you do; don't get out of the military for the sake of the NTCC because you will totally damage and mess up your life. You may eventually recover, but you will have wasted a lot of time, money and opportunities if you leave the military for the NTCC. I'm trying to help.
Leave the NTCC instead and I can almost promise, that if you act and conduct yourself like a responsible adult, that you will be so much better off and happier than you ever were while you were with the NTCC and your life will be blessed.
Many can testify of that Cheif...it's just that so many that have left, have been convinced to not come on here...or like me, we are not ready to say who we are.
It's unfortunate, because, as they say, we ARE free moral agents...
but the NTCC always put such a stigma on coming on here. There is nothing wrong with it. It is just that they don't want people finding out what info is out here. It is so freeing to see that others have gone through the same things and have thought the same things...
Conference...how many people do you think got to see their OWN family? No, they may not be saved, but it is their family. If the "leaders" can see their own, why can't the ministers and members?
Since so many people have left ntcc, they opened conference up to all church memebers to come...
it makes it look like there are still so many there...but it used to be just ministers and bible students...but if they kept it that way, it would be half empty, at most.
Double Ugh wrote..."it makes it look like there are still so many there...but it used to be just ministers and bible students...but if they kept it that way, it would be half empty, at most."
I don't know what decade(s) you were in NTCC, but I was involved from 1991 - 2008 (inclusive), and church members were always allowed to go to conference. Just not newbees. You had to faithfully attend for at least a year, and then only through approval of your Pastor.
Gregory
Chief said:
"Whoever this person is, they are absolutely targeting Bro Bellamy with intent and I have a few ideas who that individual might be."
DnA said:
This seems to be the MO for ntcc loyalists. It seems like any time a major story breaks on this blog, some copperhead comes along and dumps on the author, which in this case was Bro. Bellamy. We are considered by many to be a reproach among the ntcc faithful and even among those who have left. But the message many of us share is true and irrefutable.
There are people like Bro. Bellamy that leave the ntcc that have some pretty incredible stories that expose the ntcc for what they really are. We were all brainwashed into thinking that if we say anything against the ntcc or its leaders, that we would be speaking against God and God's people. When you begin to read testimony after testimony that reveal how Kekel and Davis became rich by abusing their offices and mistreating "God's people", you get to a place where you have no respect for them and you no longer fear these tyrants.
Because we are a voice against the ntcc, many consider us to be haters and fault finders that need to "get on with our lives" and stop being so bitter. However, our message is very necessary.
If I knew there was a copperhead in your house but failed to warn you and that copperhead was left to freely slither around your house and administer a lethal injection of venom by biting your wife or children, what kind of a person would I be?
Well, guess what? There are some very dangerous copperheads in the ntcc, and they slither around spewing out venom, and if you hang around them long enough, you or your loved ones will get snake-bit. Does this make us bitter? Do our warnings fall on deaf ears because we are filled with hate? There are many types of venom in the ntcc. There is the venom relationship manipulation, there is the venom of racism, there is the venom of scamming church members out of so much of their money that they can't even provide for their families, there are arrogant and condescending Pastors and Licensed Ad-Ministers of venom and abuse. Don't let these copperheads poison you any more. The best way to prevent this from happening to you is to stay away from them, and if you really love the people that you call your brethren, warn them to stay away from snakes.
DnA
Greg wrote...
I don't know what decade(s) you were in NTCC, but I was involved from 1991 - 2008 (inclusive), and church members were always allowed to go to conference. Just not newbees. You had to faithfully attend for at least a year, and then only through approval of your Pastor.
Chief wrote...
I started with the NTCC in 1985 and went to my first conference in 1986 and church members were allowed to go then also as long as they had been with the church for at least 1 year (with exceptions), and were considered "faithful". Being considered "faithful" meant that you paid tithe, went soul stealing and basically met the standards concerning the way you dressed (with some exceptions).
Having said that, I have seen some serious exceptions made to those rules over the years. The most notable exception was made for a woman who was not a member of the NTCC who was (at the time) and is still married to a guy in the NTCC. I know this for an absolute fact because I know this lady and her husband personally because he lives outside of Ft. Benning where I live and he was part of the same NTCC church that I was. To my understanding, our NTCC pastor got that approved because she was a member of a different church which was supposed to be similar to the NTCC. Well her church wasn't similar at all; not at least according to NTCC dress standards. It's easy to see if you open the link below by pasting it to your address bar and clicking enter. Pants and jewelry all day.
She wore pants, cut her hair quite short and wore jewelry. She is a really nice and pleasant lady by the way and for the record, I could care less if she wears jewelry and pants. The pants thing ain't Bible to begin with and the jewelry rule is broken by NTCC women regularly when they wear brooches and extra rings on their fingers. That is her picture to the upper left with a picture of she and her husband below:
http://www.unitywithpam.org
Well for conference, she would take off the jewelry and wear a dress. Of course her hair was still very short but the NTCC leadership didn't seem to care as long as her husband paid tithe. We drove to one conference together, just in separate vehicles. Hovey and his wife in one vehicle and my wife and I and our kids in a separate vehicle in a convoy. We didn't care. I knew it was contrary to the understood rules but that was none of our business.
I've also witnessed the one year faithful rule being broken and that wasn't uncommon. If you were a tithe payer, a soul stealer, and a church goer, you were pretty much good to go to conference even though occasionally the one year rule would be upheld.
So church members have always been allowed to attend as long as they met certain standards or in some cases, double standards. I would guess those standards are even lighter now. Conference is a money maker when you factor in the pledges which were always solicited and made during conference. Now that is where the real money comes in. They might make $100,000 or $200,000 in pledges. Of course that much might never actually get paid but from my experience, that much certainly did get pledged. I know because RWD would announce the amount after pledges were all tallied up.
There you have it, "New Testament Christian Chruch, The Real Story".
Chief said:
" I know because RWD would announce the amount after pledges were all tallied up. "
DnA said:
I remember that too. It was much like a Jerry Lewis Telethon, but instead of the money going towards people with muscular dystrophy, it would supposedly go towards "World Missions". At the end of every Thursday night service, Davis would read each and every pledge while the Di Francesco would tally the figures up on an adding machine. Names would be mentioned and eyebrows raised when someone gave big and smirks would form on the corners of RWD's lips when someone notable didn't give enough. We would sit there for what seemed like hours until everything was totaled up and the great shyster and con artist would announce the total and everyone would go into a frenzy of Amen's, and Praise God's.
It's always amazing to look back on things and see how this money was actually spent. World missions would bring in a lot of money but the missionaries always seemed to have very little and had church in small run down buildings, while Davis, Kekel and Ashmore were constantly upgrading into bigger mansions and newer recreational vehicles.
They are a bunch of Chippy, Cheat Swindlers and forked tongued Copperheads.
DnA
Don and Ange said...
It seems like any time a major story breaks on this blog, some copperhead comes along and dumps on the author, which in this case was Bro. Bellamy.
Chief said...
That is absolutely right because the Bellamy story was a major story. People leave the NTCC over that stuff so often and occasionally someone comes on here to discredit the author. In this case it was Bro Brill himself, (who did a terrible job and did more to discredit himself while proving Bro Bellamy right) and then someone else came on here (assuming it wasn't Bro Brill again) to try even further to discredit Bro Bellamy.
Bro Briggs came on here to discredit MDR during a different major story. The assertion was that they had all pitched in to by a gun for R.W. Davis (church member tithes and offerings hard at work) and MDR didn't put Briggs name on the card when he had also pitched in. That should have been the last thing that Bro Briggs was worried about but that's a whole different story.
So yes Don and Ange, you can best believe that if a good story breaks, some NTCC loyalist will come on here to discredit the author. Kekel did it to the Shunks but only on his blog as a result of the Shunks exposing the NTCC online. No one has tried it on me lately but Oberhauser did it a while back and someone else posted the info. They claimed that I left the church because I loved my house more than I loved God. They were really digging at that one and the fact is I do love my church a whole lot more than the "NTCC" because I can't stand the NTCC. No comparison. My house or the NTCC? House. My family or the NTCC? Family. My loving Son or the NTCC? What, are you serious? My Son's ear wax would come before the NTCC. My own urine or the NTCC? My urine will win because I can use it as fertilizer and it makes my bushes grow real good. The NTCC loses every time in every case.
We interrupt this blog for a very important sports update:
I would be remiss not to bring up football this weekend. MDR's New England Patriots host my team, the Denver Broncos at Gillette stadium in Foxboro, MA, tomorrow afternoon. This game should be a classic. Tom Brady VS Peyton Manning, both teams at 2 wins and 2 losses. Best of luck to you MDR, I hope Denver wins, but this game is so important, I'm going to half to forego the usual trash talking.
We now return you back to your regular programming.
DnA
Chippy Cheat Swindlers and Fork Tongued Copper Heads? You forgot "Hucksters". I'm real mad at you now Don and Ange!!! We've went over this before. SWINDLERS AND HUCKSTERS!!!!!! SWINDLERS AND HUCKSTERS!!!!!! SWINDLERS AND HUCKSTERS!!!!!!
How many times do I have to tell you guys?
I know they are Fork Tongued Copper Heads but that can't be included with "Chippy Cheat Swindlers". Fork Tongued Copper Heads goes along with Pilfering Purloiners.
Now I'm really mad. Forked Tongued Copper Heads don't go along with the Denver Broncos and New England Patriots.
By the way, you guys are a really nice couple and I'm really happy that you guys have each other. I mean that will all sincerity. Nice picture you guys.
"My urine will win because I can use it as fertilizer and it makes my bushes grow real good. The NTCC loses every time in every case."
DnA said:
At least your bushes grow when they get pissed on. When the ntcc pisses on somebody, nothing good comes out of it.
Sorry I forgot about the hucksters, please don't openly rebuke me anymore. They are Chippy Cheat Swindlers and Hucksters. I'm sorry I forgot, sometimes I get confused because there are so many adjectives use to describe these Hucksters. I promise that I will shine your wingtips if you treat me like a brother again and say some good things about me from your bully pulpit. I will even clean your house and wash your recreational vehicle, I mean, riding lawn mower. Oops, I really blew it now. Please have mercy.
Chief said...
By the way, you guys are a really nice couple and I'm really happy that you guys have each other. I mean that will all sincerity. Nice picture you guys.
DnA said...
Thanks Chief. I'm truly thankful for Ange and we are definitely happy and things are really looking Up^ for us now. I won't get into specifics, but we are doing great.
DnA Said...
At least your bushes grow when they get pissed on. When the ntcc pisses on somebody, nothing good comes out of it.
Chief said....
ROFLOL!!!!!!! Ha, ha, ha, ha. I got a good laugh out of that one. So true. You guys are the funniest.
You are forgiven Don but if you do it again, there is the door, don't let it hit you on the butt on the way out. SWINDLERS and HUCKSTERS!!!!!! and don't forget it.
I had written,
"it makes it look like there are still so many there...but it used to be just ministers and bible students...but if they kept it that way, it would be half empty, at most."
And Greg responded,
"I don't know what decade(s) you were in NTCC, but I was involved from 1991 - 2008 (inclusive), and church members were always allowed to go to conference. Just not newbees. You had to faithfully attend for at least a year, and then only through approval of your Pastor."
I guess, in haste, I wrote something without fully explaining myself, and I apologize.
More recently, as in 2008-2010, they have opened conference up to more without all the strict rules. If I am mistaken, someone please chime in.
When I attended NTCC for the first time in 2002, I was in the military, and I was allowed to go to the next conference, which was only a few months later. (Although, I had bought tickets to see MY family later and my pastor convinced me not to go...thus, losing the money and missing out on my family.)
I do remember being told that if I was not in the military, there would be a one year rule, as in I would have to be faithful in attending services, paying tithe and dressing right, to be able to attend conference.
I guess they were easier on the military, because we could easily be deployed or moved within that first year...either way, we know that military are targeted by them.
There were those conferences in Arizona and Graham where only Ministers and BS students were allowed to attend, but that is probably because they wanted to be able to speak freely about such things that they did not want other members to hear about. And it was usually around a time when a large group of people left NTCC.
Most recently though, (somewhere between 2008 and 2010), I do remember Kekel telling us to look around at how many people were there despite all of those that have left. But I remember hearing that they allowed more members to attend, even without that one year rule. If I am mistaken, please someone let me know.
But I know that the rules have gotten lighter, especially when you see that they are playing volley ball and games, etc at a place that used to preach against that stuff.
Even in Graham, you could drive around the houses by the school and see the Kekels playing volley ball with ministers AND students, and inside the houses, ministers are playing catch phrase and guesstures and foosball...
We all know these things were not allowed before, especially at fellowship. Sometime around the holidays, the Mike and Tanya had the single students get together in the lecture hall (which is nice, since they don't have their family there). One time, for Tanya's birthday, I remember the ladies, after a prayer meeting, bring food and gifts to the lecture hall for her, and someone mentioned bringing games. I personally did not see the games, but I know that was taboo before.
Anyway, back to the original topic...if anyone can confirm my statements about conference rules being lighter, please chime in.
Oh yeah, and you know how they preached againt television and internet?
My hubby and I went to a minister's house for fellowship and they had a flat screen tv, but they said it was only hooked up to the internet and is used for games and such. Another couple had a huge flat screen tv, but it was used for internet.
Just another exception to their rules...while those that are trying to obey as much as possible are missing out on things they really can be doing.
And don't get me started on the coupon queens...I've seen these ladies lie, bold faced, at the grocery store to get some free gushers or can of beans. They will misuse coupons, and it really creates a bunch of greedy, compromising people.
Okay, I'm done with my rant...I think.
so...since the title says to write whatever you want...I was thinking that we could list all who have left NTCC in the recent past that others may not know about.
Maybe it's not a good idea...maybe some don't want others to know...what do you guys think?
I know it helped me to know who left; it confirmed my thinking and made me wonder, "If such good, loving people have left, there must be something wrong with the org, and not just us."
Also, is anyone interested in a facebook group for exers, or would that not be a good idea?
Double Ugh said...
so...since the title says to write whatever you want...I was thinking that we could list all who have left NTCC in the recent past that others may not know about.
Chief said...
I'm all for it Double Ugh. You are speaking my language now. Others might, but I don't have a problem with it. There are plenty of people in the NTCC that knows who's left anyway. Your suggestion would be for the people who don't. Folks wonder about those things.
When I was a church member, and I knew I hadn't seen someone around for a while, if I asked about them, occasionally the answer I would get was, "Just pray for them, God knows". The answer was usually something along those lines. NTCC pastors are very secretive because they've been taught to be by the cult leader.
I've heard that many, many times, "Just pray for them".
Or, if they did mention their name, it was in a bad light.
I remember when a couple left during their time in Bible school, a really nice couple, Bernhaiser was their name, and Kekel dogged them out, right there in class, in front of everyone. Kekel had to tell us all how they left because he didn't have time to spend with his kids (they had three young boys from what I remember), and between working and BS and soul winning, there wasn't much time!
Kekel told all of us how to manage our time more wisely, making the couple look bad.
Anyway, we all know about those that have written on here about leaving, such as the
Reeds
Bellamy
Rendla
Shunks
of course DnA and Jeff :)
who else?
Butler
Barnes
Those I am not sure have came out on here, but I know of:
Armer
Ammons
Chandler
Cannon
Francis
Bullington
Bonass (the wife, not sure of the minister)
Reeves
Flemming
...I'm sure the list goes on
Facebook would be great for some and not too great for others. Ange and I have no problem at all with that idea, but be careful, because there are some folks that don't like to mix the ntcc with facebook. Also, facebook is a very intrusive program. If you invite a person into a group it automatically puts messages on there wall for all of their friends to see. I would suggest making a private room and only invite people through private messages or email. I understand folks that do not wish to mix the two. It would be like inviting a bunch of X-ers to a high school reunion. But saying that, its been done before and it's a great idea for many.
D&A, good point about facebook.
A recent conversation got me thinking about how much better my husband and I are doing since leaving the NTCC. I have a good paying job...which I never would have had if we stayed.
Before we left, we spent much time in the Word reading and talking about whether a woman can work on a job or not. We came to the conclusion that it is not against the Bible for a woman to work on a job.
When I talked to Tanya Kekel about the fact that my husband and I decided to leave the organization, she, of course, wanted to know why, and I gave her some explanation. In that, I told her that I have decided to work.
I was amazed at what came out of her mouth next! She said it's okay if I have a job and that there are many women in the NTCC that work.
I told her that my understanding was that it is looked down upon and preached against.
She said it is not preached against! Then she asked me when was the last time I heard Kekel preach against it.
I told her I can't remember, but I know it has been. She almost made me feel stupid...but we all know better. I told her that I don't want to get preached at for having a job.
Now, I know I did not just imagine this up that the NTCC preaches and teaches against women working! Kekel even wrote in his blog that it is against the Bible!!! So, did she flat out lie to me?!?
Don and Ange said "Best of luck to you MDR, I hope Denver wins, but this game is so important, I'm going to half to forego the usual trash talking".
This is the game I've been waiting for this season. The NFL said this is the "Clash of the Kings." Tom Brady and Peyton Manning are two of the best to have ever played the game. I watched Brady have a temper tantrum against the Buffalo Bills last weekend, but this is going to be a good one. So much can be said about both of these guys. It will be a very long time before anyone steps on the field and out shines either one of these great quarterbacks.
Wow! A lot has been going on since I last chimed in. I've been extremely busy these days, you know, enjoying life. Yesterday I spent a fun filled day in the mountains riding quads and shooting lots of guns with my friend Larry T...We had a "blast" pun intended. For those of you that don't Larry, he was with the Ntcc for many years. He and his family are wonderful Christians -- you know, the kind that help the homeless and needy children in other countries -- and we really have a lot fun when we get together with them. Great people!
I can relate to all the reports of life being much, much, better after departing from the cult, and make no mistake about it, ntcc is a cult, a Davis cult. They tell you about Jesus and teach you to worship Davis! Since our departure the blessings have flowed like a river...company vehicles, vacations, raises, season tickets to Seahawks' home games,and promotions. You gotta love it! God is good!!!! We have our eye on a house and looking very much forward to getting it. Just waiting on some details to be worked out.
Edward, great stuff. I like the way you dealt with "little mikey". He's a very small man (boy), in my opinion.
Brill, I hope you are doing better. Man! you've been through a lot, dude. You have a beautiful family and I hope all is well with them.
Well, It's Sunday. It's off to church and then "let the games begin!" Y-all take care now!
mdr
Hey MDR. Good to hear from you and I'm sure you had a great time with Larry T. He is a good man. As I've said before, life is been great for all of us. Enjoy church and let the games begin.
Oh and another thing for the few NTCCers who read this blog. We watch and enjoy football and you guys may be thinking, "Look at how those exers have compromised" but lets not forget. Your CEO Mike Kekel paid a considerable amount of money that you gave, so that his son could go to the finest high school and play football for years. Now his son is in a Catholic College by design. So who is the real compromiser? Not one dime of your money is going toward my football fetish. Are we any different than Kekel your CEO? Actually yes, we are.
We are not living a lie like Kekel is while spending your money in the process. On the football front, us watching and him paying so his son could play is not one bit different, and if you think so, you are more confused and deceived then you have to be anyway while remaining as a part of the NTCC. So once again, let the games begin and it won't cost a dime of your money for me to watch the NFL on Sunday.
Are you kidding me, in Graham it is a known fact, women in the NTCC do not work, Except babysitting and cleaning. No job where you pay taxes is acceptable. That is ridiculous that Tanya said it was not preached that women should not work on a job. It most certainly was, maybe they did not preach it often but, it was known women should not work, except for the above mentioned. Please, spare me, this is sickening when I read how they try to backpedal their stance on such things, next they will be saying that they never said women should not cut their hair. What a joke....
Exactly!! Whoever you are, you write and think like I do. And for the record and for what it's worth, I didn't type that last post. Whoever it is reminds me of myself.
Anon said " Please, spare me, this is sickening when I read how they try to backpedal their stance on such things, next they will be saying that they never said women should not cut their hair. What a joke...."
I've said it before and I'll say it again...It's all about semantics with these Liar's. R W Davis is liar, J H Olson is a liar, M C Kekel is a Liar (not to mention a punk of punks). They're all Liar's! Davis wouldn't know the truth if it sat down next to him. I believe we call His name Jesus.
Good to be back on Chief! I know all is well with you, so enjoy the games today. I'll be at the Patriots, Seahawks game next week so pray for me, life is tough!!
Edward said "Also, you have to understand that all of this happened almost 2 years ago. I still don't know why Rev. Kekel emailed me after so long a time".
It could be that Kekel needed a narrative going into conference to set themselves up as being under the attack of the "devil" on the blogs. This, of course, gives them the preaching material they need to rally the "troops". I can't remember the last time that Davis had any substantive material for a conference. I wonder if he opened it up for questions again. You know, questions like, Pastor, should I buy two-ply or one-ply toilet paper? ;0)
That's the conclusion we came to also MDR: that Kekel needed ammunition for conference.
It's so sad.
I am still waiting to hear from him. Tanya told me that he was going to call me...still haven't heard from him...maybe he is waiting till next conference?
Regarding the Cult policy on women working; here is a quote from Senior Pastor Kekel's Blog: "One of the biggest enemies of aging Ministers is their fear that they won’t be taken care of in their old age. This fear causes them to resort to secular education and employment, abandoning the call of God; but the key is taking care of their old age, in their youth. Then, the wives go on jobs too, which is against the bible, and they find that the same spending habits that got them into the mess, rob them of happiness, even with a double income."
Again, this was a a quote from a recent post by him on his Blog. Senior Pastor Kekel posted it on 4 February 2011 in a preaching message post titled "Fight or Flight."
Whether Senior Pastor Kekel is preaching this or not doesn't matter, because we can't know what he preaches if we are not there. But, reading what he writes, and quoting it is another matter altogether.
Although, Senior Pastor Kekel shares in the referenced post that he has preached this.
Gregory
I grew up in the organization,women don't work on a job after they get married. Then when you get married you can't pay your bills,the elecric gets turned off etc.
We moved from one state to another,barely had any money. We called RWD for help,gave us enough gas money to get there,and had to pay it back.
I am so happy to be away from NTTC,the chains are gone and now I am free!!!
My mom is still there,wasn't easy to leave,but so glad I did.
We are getting new furniture,God has blessed us so much!!
Yes I work outside the home,but I have made so many true friends who love me. I take care of children who need love and someone to care about them. They come running to you and want hugs! It's so rewarding.
In the NTCC,I was told in front of BS class I had no personality,I know now they just wanted me to conform to their ways. I had low self esteem because of them,not anymore,not only do I work,but a night Lead of the staff at work.
GOD IS GOOD AND GREATLY TO BE PRAISE!!
Anonymous said...
My mom is still there, wasn't easy to leave, but so glad I did.
Chief said...
That's what I'm talking about. Another good ending. Free at last, free at last.
Wow, Anonymous! The borg is so mean to tell you that you had no personality! They are the ones who create an impossible environment so a person cannot prosper in any way. Man these bullies make me mad! But, whatever. The good news is that you didn't let them stop you! Now you have moved from being their victim to being a conqueror and overcomer! GOOD FOR YOU!
I'd rather have no personality than the toxic one they're modeling.
Anonymous said...
In the NTCC,I was told in front of BS class I had no personality.
Chief said...
And in front of the B.S. B**l S**t class (knowing what I know now) I'd tell them to Kiss My A**. Abusive Jerks. Such an abuse of authority. They have no authority over me now because I wouldn't allow it. They won't have any authority in the after life either because God knows they are a bunch of crooks. I'd give all them shysters a piece of my mind.
On 10/6 Greg replied to Double Ugh - think I got that right about conference - and about the AZ conference - first the AZ conference was fairly quickly arranged b/c of the HOP split and they wanted to warn every one about it. They wanted to regroup as many as they could - after all that was $$$ walking away from them! I remember b/c no one would tell me (as I wasn't married quite yet to one of the "Preachers") what it was all about. All I know afterwards is the pastor and his wife kept checking on ME to make sure the HOP folk hadn't contacted me. They were afraid someone would and take me away. That's not what they said but now I see that is what they were saying so to speak. They told me some people had left and they were "Concerned" they might want to be in contact with me. Concerned my patootin buns. LOL
Conference rules were as Greg answered - 1 year unless Military. They target military b/c they are used to discipline and saying YES SIR to anything they are told to do. All you military folk know leaving Uncle Sam, especially if you were there for a while means you have to restructure life. NTCC offers a YES SIR environment so its easier to catch disciplined prey. I'm just going to keep praying God continues to help people find freedom! I want to share more of my story and name but I am working with some people who are considering leaving or who have left. I'm praying for a few others that I helped encourage their life in there. I don't come to the blog too often but since I found it this has been a blessing to read and write. I appreciate you all for having a safe place to vent and encourage healthy new true Godly growth post NTCC!
My opinion on why they are getting so relaxed on games, volleyball etc. . . . . they are losing too many people and they are lowering THEIR standards. There is NOTHING wrong with some volleyball and so now they justify it as "OK". Well they did damage in my families life b/c they didn't encourage family time instead robbed all of our time. It's ok, GOD is in control now and it's coming together. . . . 1 day at a time!
Anyone agree that is why they are now allowing games, etc?
They are allowing all this because Kekel never agreed with the rules in the first place and RWD is getting old. Additionally, RWD isn't going to buck against his daughter and Kekel. The NTCC is a sorry crooked organization and it doesn't matter what they allow. Nothing short of RWD and Kekel standing up in conference and admitting that they are both a couple phony double standard hypocrites would be good enough for me. And even then, that wouldn't give all those NTCC children their childhoods back and it wouldn't give us our money back either.
AMEN Chief! Amen
Sure, that's why they're letting up...back in the day, all this would have been blasted as "compromise." But it's a new day now with the Mike & Phil show, and they're trying their best to revise history and make all that crap we put up with disappear from memory. Too bad there are thousands of people who know differently, and some don't hesitate to remind the world of just how hypocritical these phonies are. Any Google search instantly reveals the dirt on NTCC, and their pathetic permanently-under-construction website can't defend them from the crushing truths shared by those who have escaped their sick control. It's way harder for them to trap suckers nowadays, since the word is out on their scam. Publicizing their evil practices is therapeutic, and can become an enjoyable pastime. I encourage everyone to join in and help spread the sordid reality of NTCC; every voice contributes to the likelihood that another soul will be spared years of abuse and torment.
You know I just wanted to share a positive thing. I was studying for something I'm doing. Since I have gone thru mental & spiritual healing, one day I said to God, Lord, when you feel I'm ready, I am willing to be there to help others who have pain and don't know what to do.
Well, thru classes I took (after I could muster going finding a new REAL Christlike church - I could b/c #1 I had a real relationship pre ntcc and God was with me as I left ntcc). Anyway, I was asked to be a home group leader. I said I couldn't, I felt like Moses and certainly I wasn't worthy. God and I talked about well maybe even argued a bit but He showed me it wasn't going to be ME but Him thru me, just like Moses. I finally returned with I change my mind. They asked me to pick a topic. I told them my heart was to help others who were hurting. Well no one had approached that yet but they knew the passion in my heart was sincere. They knew the change in my life. And so the home group came to be. There are 6 women who are from FIVE different churches (GASP that we share). The healing has been amazing! Tho they aren't ntcc hang ups they are real legit things that oppressed them.
I'm so thankful that God lead me out. I'm not thankful for the abuse I went thru but in the end I'm glad God never left me. He sat there all along waiting for me to say enough and turn to Him.
I am so thankful for the blogs too. It's helping me with residual feelings.
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