MDR Wrote... Hello everyone! We hope that you've all had a wonderful summer. We certainly have because we actually got to enjoy one!
The other day we ran into Sister Warwick at Wal-Mart, formerly known as Sis. Norton. She was quite distraught about her husband who fell asleep behind the wheel and had been in a car accident on his way to work. He is recovering from foot surgery and will be out of work an extended period of time.
She told me that she was going to ask "brother kekel" if he knew anybody who could help them get a car. I told her, why don't you go to RWD and ask him for help. You've been a loyal member for 40+ yrs. He should help you. I told her, he has enough money to buy you a dealership, let alone one car. Her reply was, Pastor is out of town right now. I then told her go to "brother kekel". He's got enough money to buy you three cars. I said come on, you've proved your loyalty. You've been faithful for all these years. Someone should help you, and with no strings attached.
Well, word has it that Pa Kinson made a "pastoral visit" and Sister Warwick asked him if she would get in trouble for asking other churches for financial help in her time of need. And word has it that Pa Kinson's reply was, "Of course, you can do that. That's what they're there for"
Another compassionate moment on display by NTCC.
56 comments:
Someone like Briggs will take up a collection for this lady and bail her out and she'll think the ntcc saved the day. She probably won't even realize that it was the ntcc who put her in this position in the first place.
The Warwicks are at an advanced age, at least by my estimation. At this stage of their lives, they should be enjoying retirement.
I hope this sparks some help from the ntcc. Now that would be a sign of real change.
It is very telling that "pa kinson" didn't offer this sister from his congregation any help. How many more years must you put into the ntcc for them to consider you faithful and "in" enough to give you financial aid in a desperate time of need. Instead, this poor lady is sent on her way. Probably with a "God bless you, we love and appreciate you" send off. And what does he mean by " that's what they are there for". What about the church she and her husband have attended and funded all these years? Where is the charity/love? Where is the compassion? Maybe they have forgotten what Jesus taught concerning giving/helping those in need. Maybe it's time for pa kinson to instead ask himself, "what are we (ntcc) here for?" Oh, yea, to fleece the sheep.
signed, polaris
I was at the Tillicum church several years ago when Pastor Kinson was telling about a woman who came and asked for financial help. He said we take up offerings around here. We don't give them.
"He said we take up offerings around here. We don't give them."
Chilling!
Anonymous said...
I hope this sparks some help from the ntcc. Now that would be a sign of real change.
Chief said...
No it wouldn't. They would be just covering their back and I doubt they'll do that anyway. Real change would be them not promoting an environment where people live like the Warwicks. It's the NTCCs system that put people in that situation. Wanting to go to church all the time, giving too much of your money away to a millionaire, not working enough when you should be working or not working at all. The NTCCs system doesn't work for the masses. It makes the majority of them remain broke.
Real change would be the sorry NTCC leadership admitting that they've mislead all these women by telling them they can't work. The Bible does not teach that a woman can't work but Proverbs 31 teaches the contrary. It's not sin for a woman to have a job and in fact Proverbs 31 teaches that a virtuous woman will have a job. That is why people like the Warwicks are so stuck. They can't get ahead because they won't work together and the husband gives too much of his money to the church and he won't work in the evenings or the weekends.
Real change would be the NTCC shutting down and Kekel the con artist and RDUB the Dupester redistributing all the money they've accumulated from being con artists.
Chief
I was at the Tillicum church several years ago when Pastor Kinson was telling about a woman who came and asked for financial help. He said we take up offerings around here. We don't give them.
Kinson is a complete jerk. Kinson, Kekel or Davis shouldn't get a dime of your money. The answer isn't expecting a handout from those jerks. The answer is STOP being SUCKERS and STOP GIVING THEM YOUR MONEY. Then you won't be in that kind of trouble.
Man I can STAND the NTCC. How can people be so blind when there is so much of this kind of information available? Man I need to open up a church and find me a bunch of suckers who will give me their money. I'll put a title over the front door saying, "Can't you see I'm trying to become a millionaire around here"? "We don't give out offerings we take up offerings". "Don't come here looking for a handout"!
CHIEF
"That's what they're there for"
That's right. Other churches are there to help people after NTCC has ground their faces into the dirt. Other churches will care for you, but if you need some guilt and shame, come on over to the org and we'll crank up the condemnation machine...oh wait, that won't be necessary, it runs 24/7! So it won't really take much additional energy to inform you that you have as much money as you want to have, and the reason you don't have any is because you spent it all (although they will conveniently forget to mention that a large chunk of the spent resources went directly into NTCC coffers).
But don't ask for help; we take up offerings, we don't give them. Can you imagine some fat cat preacher telling that to a destitute woman asking for help? He sounds like the chief iceberg of the First Church of the Frigidaire. I live in Fairbanks, Alaska, and it doesn't get half that cold even up here in January.
Anonymous said...I hope this sparks some help from the ntcc. Now that would be a sign of real change.
Chief said...No it wouldn't. They would be just covering their back and I doubt they'll do that anyway. Real change would be them not promoting an environment where people live like the Warwicks.
Jeff, you are right on.
I dont know if it was very wise to publish the name of this lady.
As far as I know sis norton has always had a babysitting job but had to quit because of a heart condition.
I doubt very seriously if she would change her mind about the ntcc because she is one of the original people that follow rwd to start a church way back then.
Hopefully this story will put the fear in those that are starting out.
You can never leave your future in the hands of others, otherwise you'll find yourself old and with nothing to show for it.
I know exactly what they will say :"What? you don't have insurance? You can't afford to drive a car if you can't afford insurance!"
Someone wrote...
You can never leave your future in the hands of others, otherwise you'll find yourself old and with nothing to show for it.
Chief said...
Very true indeed. You can't say it much better then that.
Chief
Sebring said...
I know exactly what they will say :"What? you don't have insurance?
Chief said...
That is also the truth. The problem is only full coverage insurance will cover your vehicle if you are the one who is at fault for it's destruction. Then if the vehicle is only worth $500 - $1000 which is the case with many people, it wouldn't matter much if you had full coverage or not. I only have liability on two of my vehicles because they are not worth much. My wife's 2009 has full coverage because if it got wrecked I would need it replaced with a vehicle of at least the same value.
It's all relative but you are right. These NTCC jerks would say something like that. I would agree with them if it weren't for the fact that their oppressive system results in many people not even having enough money for insurance or a replacement car if the one they have liability on gets destroyed.
Chief
If Sister Warwick does not know you are blabbing about her and her personal life, she will very shortly.
Deo Volente
This blabbing may get her help.
Deo Volente
If Sister Warwick does not know you are blabbing about her and her personal life, she will very shortly.
Chief said...
And? Should I be shaking? You are worried about quote "blabbing" when you should be worried about the Sister being essentially broke needing a handout specifically from other churches! You should be worried about the sorry NTCC leadership who drives people into poverty and keeps them there. You should be worried about the sorry system that put Sis Warwick in the predicament she is in. Assuming you are part of the NTCC, your church has some serious issues to put it lightly.
Don't the testimonies of Kinson's remarks concern you or did you even read that part? This is good information that people should know about. If I had access to this kind of info years ago, I wouldn't have wasted as much time and money as I did with the NTCC and it's crooked leaders.
Chief
"If Sister Warwick does not know you are blabbing about her and her personal life, she will very shortly."
And you seemed to be worried about the image of your Church more than you are this sister and her family who sound like they are very close to being destitute.
Anonymous said...
"This blabbing may get her help."
If may very well be that this "babbling" may be the ONLY WAY SHE CAN GET HELP!!!
I don't know this lady. (It seems like I remember the name, albeit vaguely) but I hope she gets the help that it sounds like she so desperately needs, Even if she has to go to another church. Perhaps this will start the wheels in motion in her mind about what is going on.
Is this the mother of a Pam Norton? Is this the right name or family?
yes this is the mother of pam norton. its rather amazing how events run in full circle. this is the same pam norton who alleged that davis had conducted himself inappropriately with her. this is the same mother who because of her loyality to davis accused her daughter pam of lying while basically disowning pam. ironically mrs warwicks back is now against the wall. not surprising. she turned her back on her daughter for davis and the new testament christian church. now she is seeking donations from other churches. they say God dont like ugly. if asked and if mrs warwick felt like being truthful she would verify that her daughter had made such allegations. i would say pastor has quite the questionable background.
Anonymous said...
I would say pastor has quite the questionable background.
Chief said...
I'd say that's an understatement. The dude is a straight up con artist who's main weakness is women. It's not a problem that RWD has never got control over the lust of the flesh. That's not uncommon. I do have a problem with him being a hypocrite while preaching at everyone else about what he's never got control of.
Yeah it is something how things seem to surface. Boy these old timers in the NTCC sure have some dead bones in the closet. The funny thing is these bones were hidden in the closet while these people were already quote "saved" and members of the NTCC. The problem is when you decide to fly the "holiness" banner you better walk a straight line. RDUB has been blasting people for years but what he didn't count on was a bunch of people leaving the NTCC whose lives he made miserable and who knew about his dirty deeds. You can't blast people for years and expect them to never blast you back, especially when you've provided them with plenty of ammo.
If only half the stories I've heard about RDUBs illicit affairs and lustful tendencies are true, he should have never stepped one foot behind a pulpit. If you live in a glass house, don't throw stones.
Word has it that RDUB hates the internet. It wouldn't surprise me if God created it just for him. RDUB and his corrupt organization were flying below the radar before the internet came along.
Well this thread has taken a strange turn. Davis may never get his while he is here on this earth but some of his loyal followers sure have. Many of them are too blind to see that that Davis is the cause.
Chief
you know Chief, I was thinking about this poor lady and her predicament.
I was going on in my mind that this couple has never gone out of Graham to pastor or minister and yet they have no money.
The conclusion that we come to is that the org. keeps their members poor, because of their policy of having to be in every service and when are you gonna have time to do other things? Unless of course you are in the "elite group"
Just think about it Chief, this mr warwick is falling asleep at the wheel? why? because he doesn't get any sleep attending all the services in order to be counted faithful!
And just on a side note, mr warwick is not the only one who has had such an accident, there's been several other ministers that sadly enough didn't escape with a broken bone but paid with their lives! One was an evangelist travelling between churches and the other was a minister helper.
Just sad that people will not use common sense for their families sake!
The Philippines is up again. Someone over there really likes reading this blog. Maybe it's the Right Reverend Wright? Instead of reading this blog he should try to amends with his daughters and be sincere about it for once in his life. Especially the daughter he abandoned when she went to stay with him. These NTCC guys are a real piece of work. Men of God they say? How about ungodly men. These guys are some of the most low down people you will ever meet. Believe it and receive it.
I'm glad someone else brought up others falling asleep at the wheel. These guys take these jobs and sometimes second jobs to support their families b/c their wives aren't allowed to work and they have find something to fit the schedule. Meanwhile they are killing themselves literally. Folks, it's not worth it! NTCC is not worth it. Trying to prove that you are saved by following rules and keeping loyal to men is not the way to live. That's not what Jesus made you for. You were made to do great things. Don't get injured or killed living for NTCC. quit that church, quit those extra jobs and walk in grace, freedom, and truth!
Just think about it Chief, this Mr Warwick is falling asleep at the wheel? why? because he doesn't get any sleep attending all the services in order to be counted faithful!
And just on a side note, Mr Warwick is not the only one who has had such an accident, there's been several other ministers that sadly enough didn't escape with a broken bone but paid with their lives! One was an evangelist traveling between churches and the other was a minister helper.***
Les Contreras fell asleep at the wheel once and crashed his car. he was able to fix it since he was a body and fender person and sell it and buy another car. I remember going to work with him at K-Bee toys warehouse. Since we both worked at the same place we car pooled. I remember watching him on the way to work nod off time and time again. I never said anything to him but it used to really bother me. Of course that kind of thing happens whenever you are trying to pastor a church, as well as work a full time job, as well as manage an apartment complex, as well as throw an afternoon paper route.
Anonymous said...
I was going on in my mind that this couple has never gone out of Graham to pastor or minister and yet they have no money.
Chief said...
You made some excellent points. That is sad. Yes the NTCC leadership is responsible but of course the people brought much of it upon themselves. They kept themselves broke with all those services while constantly giving offerings, Davis tricking everyone with teaching that woman can't lawfully work, people not working when work is available i.e. weekends and evenings. This is a big ticket to poverty world and it's been proven time and time again. I care but it's not my problem. Why? Because I work where I must and when I must and so does my wife. My family is my responsibility. If these NTCC guys like being broke looking for handouts that's THEIR problem, not mine.
Guess what? Since I left the NTCC I've had more money then I ever had while I was in, so their dooms day, you'll be broke when you leave prophecies are trash. And I've had a better life. You know why? Because I ignored their garbage directives. I didn't put their sorry church in front of taking care of my family. When I had to work on the weekend or in the evening I did, regardless of what their false prophets said. So now I'm not running around to other churches looking for a free ride and a handout because I can't even afford a stinking car.
Not only is the NTCC not going to be there when you need them, I don't want to find myself in a position to have to need them. So listen. Going to one more sorry abusive church service should absolutely not take precedence over working. One more church service ain't going to get you saved!!!! Women, stop letting these insecure, male chauvinist control mongers keep you from being virtuous and working at a real job like the women mentioned in Proverbs Chapter 31. If you want to be a "keeper at home" than be domestically inclined and a "good house keeper" because that is what it means to be a keeper at home.
Just because Davis didn't trust his wife because he thinks all men are dogs like he is and he was afraid of her getting screwed by her boss, doesn't mean you can't lawfully get a job!!!!!!!!!!!!
Chief
You see other than the hypocrisy, double standards, nepotism and lack of common decency among NTCC pastors, the thing I can't stand the most about the NTCC is they way they keep so many of their people in poverty. It's not because people squander and or can't manage money. It's because the NTCC system fosters the existence of poverty ridden families. Here is the equation that equates to becoming poverty stricken in the NTCC. This equation stands true unless you figure out a way to get involved in all their real-estate ventures or you are a pastor who doesn't mind taking advantage of your people. Here is the equation that equates to poverty in the NTCC:
Going to church too much while giving too much money to the church too regularly +
Spending most or all of your free time doing things for the church that costs you extra money +
Running all over creation burning up your precious gas for every church function the sorry NTCC leadership can dream up +
Giving way too much money for special bogus offerings like for pews or song books or so called "world missions" +
Spending what little extra money you do have every year on conferences where you give more money for "world missions" and multiple offerings +
Only taking sorry jobs where you can only work M-F from 9-5 +
Refusing great jobs which sometimes require you to work on weekends or evenings +
Quitting jobs for the sake of attending money making NTCC events specifically like conference +++
Women being tricked into not working which is not biblical +
Wasting your time and money at the NTCS all put together = (POVERTY) with very few exceptions.
This is why there are so many broke NTCCers like Sis Warwick running around.
Here is the normal equation for steady cash flow and monetary stability and it's bible:
1 Tim 5:8 But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel. +
Proverbs 31 which shows a women being virtuous "BECAUSE" she does in fact have a JOB = Financial Stability the good old American way.
Providing for "your own house" is not providing for Kekel's house which is exactly what you are doing when you give your money to the NTCC. When you give your money to the NTCC it's not going to the fatherless or widow or needy or poor which is what the Bible advocates. The Bible never promotes giving your money to a millionaire so he can become yet even richer. Show me one scripture where that is the case?
Chief
I've been saying this all along. If you ain't providing for your own house because you are giving your money to the NTCC, according to the Bible you aren't even saved!!!! What are you accomplishing? Your family has to go around looking for handouts? You are not even saved and I didn't say it the Bible did. 1 Tim 5:8......
I'd rather take care of my family, miss some services, not give money to the NTCC and risk going to hell then give my money to the NTCC, not take care of my own house and guarantee I go to hell!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Be worse than an infidel if you want to but I'm not the one. I'm done taking care of the Kekels the Kinsons and Davis. I'm taking care of my family now and it feels so gooooood!!!!
Chief, Cha Chief, Cha Chief Chief Chief.
Chief, I feel your passion.
I had to dig some old notebooks about the notes I got at some conferences, and remember rwd starting the service with the following: I've been serving the Lord for 50 years and have yet to get a pink slip! God never does that!
I could hear people fidgeting while we would hear this same thing, over and over throughout the years.
Now I think that he must've been the only one right with God the rest of us were always in one way or another, broke! But now we found out that if it wasn't for the investments that he made in real estate, he would be like the regular people in ntcc.
I remember bro. reed bringing up mck preaching about how that many of the old preachers get bitter because they were not wise enough to put the teaching of saving and paying yourself that rwd taught, and now they were without and that is why some have left.
It boggles the mind to think that after doing all that is expected they are yet found in want.
Could it be that there is some fallacy in the doctrine of ntcc?
Why is it that only a few are well off when the rest are living from hand to mouth.
Anonymous asked...
Why is it that only a few are well off when the rest are living from hand to mouth.
Chief said...
It's simple for anyone who is interested in the truth. RWD is completely full of it. We all would have invested in real estate if years ago we basically had an endless supply of cash to invest with. It's a pyramid scheme plain and simple. Sure RWD invested. He had all the money in the world to invest with. How do you think Kekel got his. What did he ever do as a pioneer? NOTTA!!! He was placed in Graham with a large congregation and a serious cash flow and is it a miracle that he had money to invest in property? It's a family business and it don't take a genius to figure that out. How much money do you suppose they paid Tanya to work at the NTCS? They were one of the few families with a dual income. Is it any wonder that Kekel is rich? It had nothing to do with them quote "serving God". It had to do with them using the name of God for profit. PLAIN AND SIMPLE!!!!
It doesn't matter what I write. There is an endless supply of suckers who would follow RWD and Kekel if they were both convicted felons. They'd blame it on the devil. Whatever!!!
Chiefster
When riding to my first conference in 1984, Donald Hummel was driving his Mercury Marquis and fell asleep at the wheel on the way to St. Louis from Ft. Bragg, NC. In ntcc they always made that trip in one shot; it's like a 17 hour road trip! When Hummel lost control of his car, he did a 180 degree spin ON THE INTERSTATE and swiped the side of his car against a guard rail. After the accident, I remember Hummel saying that the angels reached down and stopped the vehicle from colliding with other vehicles; so none of us were hurt. In retrospect it would have made a lot more sense if the Angel would have knocked him upside the head!
All of us have done a lot of stupid things in the ntcc. And driving 17 hours straight is one of them. But you had to. You had to have your Sunday evening service. And you had to be at the camp to sign in before the Monday evening service! So guess what> That required driving straight through.
None of us were injured; and the car was still drive-able. So we made it to conference alive.
Don and Ange
Anonymous said davis shared something like ' I've been serving the Lord for 50 years and have yet to get a pink slip! God never does that!'--r w davis
DnA say,
r w davis never got a pink slip because he never worked a job! Unless you count swindling Christians as a job!!!
"All of us have done a lot of stupid things in the ntcc. And driving 17 hours straight is one of them. But you had to. You had to have your Sunday evening service. And you had to be at the camp to sign in before the Monday evening service! So guess what> That required driving straight through."
Yup, that's the way it was. We would drive straight through from Washington. We did it a couple times from Fairbanks to Washington, and that was some hairy travel down the Alaska Highway. Broke down once on the way back in Cassiar, BC, with about 1,000 miles to go. There was no motel; a gold miner let us sleep in his single wide mobile home. They had to fly a rebuilt transmission up from Vancouver and then drive 110 miles to get it. We were stuck there a week. It was the closest thing I'd had to a vacation in some years, and I enjoyed it even though it was below zero and costing me money I sorely needed for other things. It's pretty sad that it took such extremes just to get a break.
Then RW would get up and blast everyone for not leaving a few days early and staying in motels, or flying instead of driving (as if we had the means to afford such luxury). It was a cruel mockery. According to him, we didn't have any money because we spent it all. He was right--we spent it like he told us, on the "Program of God." Everything was a Catch-22: you were supposed to save at least $5K before going out to pioneer a work, but NTCC was such a giant leech on the wallet that no on I ever heard of could accumulate enough. He dogged Malone out for months because Jeff was trying to do what he was taught and save the money. But then he was under fire for "letting Cleveland die and go to hell" while he dithered and delayed. No one could fulfill all the conflicting requirements placed on us.
It was (and is) a demented circus.
Vic said...
Broke down once on the way back in Cassiar, BC
Jeff said...
I can't tell you how many times I've read a similar story about an NTCCer failing to effectively drive from point A to point B. Vehicles regularly breaking down, people falling asleep at the wheel, people "DYING" because they fell asleep at the wheel, people being stranded with limited or no funds like Vic described!!!!!
What is with this whole situation. The NTCCs system is broke. Someone would get relieved of their authority if all that stuff happened within someones company or platoon in the Army. Boy oh boy the NTCC promotes some really messed up practices. The NTCC is absolutely a menace to society. What if one of these brothers fell asleep and killed someone other than himself? You want to talk about irresponsible? Do you think? The more I read about the NTCC, (which is quite often because of this blog) the more I hate their deeds. Oh, just because I said I hate the deeds of the NTCC, don't judge me you non Bible knowing, self righteous, judgmental NTCCer.
Here is what Jesus said:
Rev 2:6 But this thou hast, that thou hatest the deeds of the Nicolaitanes, which I also hate.
Chief said...
Let me rephrase that scripture:
Chief 2:6 But this thou hast, that thou hatest the deeds of the NTCCaitanes which I also hate.
So the moral of the story is there is nothing wrong with hating the deeds of evil people like the NTCC leadership. Go judge Jesus if you have a problem with what I wrote.
Chief, Cha Chief, Cha Chief Chief Chief
Talking about people falling asleep at the wheel, I remember one conference, on the first service we were asked to pray for bro. casanova because on his way to conference he had fallen asleep at the wheel and sadly enough he ended up in the hospital, thank goodness that the others travelling with him didn't get hurt. He was driving with his wife and I think somebody else was following behind and they saw the whole ordeal. I think we all stood up and prayed because the poor brother didn't have insurance and can you imagine the hospital bill?
I remember rwd reprimanded us all for not using common sense!
Anonymous said...
I remember one conference, on the first service we were asked to pray for bro. casanova because on his way to conference he had fallen asleep
I remember rwd reprimanded us all for not using common sense!
Chief said...
Asked to pray? How about stopping the foolishness. Here would be my prayer.
"Lord, help these men and women see that the NTCC is a phony, bogus organization. Lord help them see that this blow hard, greedy, money hungry RWD with all his mandates is the reason why so many people are running around with no insurance getting in car accidents. Help them see Lord that these NTCC leaders are slave drivers and as result too many NTCCers don't get enough sleep and some people have even died falling asleep at the wheel."
RWD is full of it. Passing the buck and saying that people don't use common sense? His whole organization and the fact that RDUB advocates quitting jobs to attend conference isn't using common sense. If he wouldn't have taught so many abusive pastors to be slave drivers, they wouldn't be driving people into the ground and exhaustion to the degree that they can't even stay awake while driving a car.
The people aren't the problem, RWD and his leaders are the problem. If that trash happened in the Army, the Company Commander, Platoon Sergeant and everyone else would get relieved. Just another example of why the NTCC sucks.
Chief
"I can't tell you how many times I've read a similar story about an NTCCer failing to effectively drive from point A to point B."
Chief, I've actually contemplated writing a book about my car misadventures, the majority of which occurred during the NTCC years. In addition the Cassiar experience, we also broke down both moving to and coming back from Philadelphia. Each time, we lived in a tent for a week (WooHoo, two more vacations!) while the car was being repaired. We broke down going to conference once on a Saturday night. By some miracle, the junkyard we found the next day was operated by Seventh Day Adventists and was open on Sundays, so we got an alternator and installed in in their parking lot. I could go on and on, and yes, it's a miracle that I never nodded off and killed myself and/or others; God knows how many times I snapped out if it when my chin hit my chest while driving.
Here's a classic: Dan Fowler was driving to conference once, and got so exhausted that he pulled over to catch a nap. There had been something on the radio about a law being retroactively applied, and in his fatigue, that information entered his dreams. He dreamed that a law was passed prohibiting anyone from addressing the assistant mayor by any other title. This law was to be retroactively applied, and Dan had in the past addressed the assistant mayor by a different title, so now they were coming to arrest him. He was fleeing in his car when he awoke--DRIVING DOWN THE ROAD IN HIS SLEEP!
It is so weird that the story of the warwicks can bring more and more examples.
People out there probably can tell us more and more stories of people not using common sense for their families sake.
The man that died recently around a year ago left a wife and his twin sons. I don't know what became of them, if they remained in the city they were helping or if she went back to graham, I don't know.
All I remember is that he was a young father trying to "make it happen"
And now those babies are gonna grow up without their dad!
It wouldn't be a big deal if it was just an isolated incident but no, there are countless of examples of people pushing themselves harder and harder in the name of doing something for God when in reality they are just doing in it for a man!
Talking about people falling asleep at the wheel, I remember one conference, on the first service we were asked to pray for bro. casanova because on his way to conference he had fallen asleep at the wheel and sadly enough he ended up in the hospital, thank goodness that the others travelling with him didn't get hurt. He was driving with his wife and I think somebody else was following behind and they saw the whole ordeal. I think we all stood up and prayed because the poor brother didn't have insurance and can you imagine the hospital bill?
I remember rwd reprimanded us all for not using common sense!
You got it wrong. Traveling with the Cassanova's were the Giles. They were thrown from the vehicle and Giles wife had a broken hip and some other things wrong. Giles, if I'm not mistaken was in a neck brace. Winona was under the overturned car with cuts and brusises. It was a good thing the car was not turned back over cause they would have crushed her.
Also there was a incident with the girls dorm. I believe Genevieve C, Lillian S. and some others were in the car. One of the girls fell asleep and they had an accident trying to get back to be at work on Mon. morning.
Living Free said...
You got it wrong.
Chief said...
I can appreciate some clarification. Having said that I'll tell you what wasn't wrong; the fact that there is a history of NTCC people falling asleep at the wheel of a moving automobile. I fault the leadership almost exclusively. Yes it is irresponsible but these sorry NTCC leaders promote stuff like attending the Sunday Morning Service at their home church the same day they should be leaving for conference. I know, I experienced it with Mayers. Thankfully we only had to drive from Atlanta.
They have you driving people all over creation to make their numbers look good but in the process you loose too much sleep.
They have you attending 5 or more services a week and of course you then have to take care of your "REAL" responsibilities between soul snatching, (I mean winning?) mowing the church lawn, every kind of meeting these pastors can dream up, choir practice, picking stuff up for the church, follow up, visitation and on and on. We won't even talk about it if you have children!!!!!! What time do you have for them?????
Is it any surprise dudes are falling asleep at the wheel? NONE! It goes back to the same thing. Stop attending so many services so you can have enough time for your "real" responsibilities which include sleep and stop giving all your money away to a bunch of swindlers who are already millionaires.
Once again, "Whatever"! You can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink. Stupid is as stupid does. I had my fill. Hey, don't take it personal. It takes one to know one. I couldn't have been too smart to spend as many years as I did in the NTCC.
Chief
There you have it folks, if the plot doesn't get any thicker.
Thanks Chief for being a good moderator.
Without this blog I don't know if there would be another way of reading and posting about the life that we all have experienced in the org.
I hope that you have a great labor weekend!
Anonymous said...
Thanks Chief for being a good moderator.
Chief said...
Much obliged. It's good to know folks appreciate all the work thats been put into this blog. Of course that's not why we do it. The public needs to know. What they do with that knowledge is up to them. Unfortunately many ignore it and simply write it off. Others (many in the NTCC) think we are the devil on earth.
Others recognize that they've gone through the same types of things that's been testified of here and they take action by leaving the NTCC. Thanks again.
Chief
It appears as though someone from Atlanta is reading this blog? Of course I used to live there so I wonder who? Don't matter.
Chief
Chief said "Yes it is irresponsible but these sorry NTCC leaders promote stuff like attending the Sunday Morning Service at their home church the same day they should be leaving for conference."
Wonder why? Glad you asked! That "scum bucket" Davis can kill two birds with one Sunday service!
First it keeps the Pastors/church Tithe coming in to the org.
Secondly it keeps the ministers from visiting loved ones/family to and from the conference. We couldn't have that now, could we?
Another story from the chronicles of a fatigued ntcc driver.
A very dangerous state of mind that happens to people while driving fatigued is that their subconscious mind takes over while driving. Your eyes are still open and you are going through all the motions but your mind is gone. Many of your motoring skills are paralyzed, while the majority of your brain functions are involved in hallucinations or dreams.
This is similar to another condition in the ntcc brought on by sleep deprivation. When your alarm clock goes off, your brain sends a signal to your arm to reach up and press whatever button turns it off. Your mind figures this out while you are sleeping with the reasoning that if you press that button, the noise will stop, so you do it subconsciously without even waking up. When you do awake, you don't remember your alarm ever going off but you know for a fact that you set it.
I can't tell you how many times in the ntcc that I was driving subconsciously and woke up to a hallucination. What happened to me on many occasions was that my eyes would fixate on something and my mind would turn it into something else. A factory on the side of the road would turn into a Space ship or an overpass would turn into cliff. The closer you got to the object the more your brain would try to make sense of it and sometimes you would catch yourself swerving to try to avoid the hallucination. When you finally snapped out of it, you felt the need to make a trip to Walmart to purchase some new under britches. It was a horrifying experience because at times you come close to killing yourself and you realize this.
One time I was driving fatigued to a conference and my mind was fixated on the car in front of me. The car in front of me divided into two cars and I didn't know which one to follow. When I snapped out of it, I found I was swerving all over the road and I almost crapped a blue onion with Cadillac fenders. Sorry for the colorful euphemism, but this is what the ntcc does to people. They keep you going on very small amounts of sleep and then they leave it up to God to keep you from your own stupidity. I must have fell out of a stupid tree and hit every branch on the way down because this happened so many times and I never learned from it. Thinking back on this, I was stupid for staying in the ntcc for so long. It totally defies common sense.
Now that I am free from the ntcc, I drive a truck. Is that scary or what? But, seriously, when I get tired, I pull over and go to sleep. There is no freight worth dying for and believe me, there is no ntcc service, fellowship meeting or conference that is worth dying for either.
DnA
"Grace loves and extends mercy to people covered with religious manure because it too is a sin for which Jesus died in order to extend us GRACE!"
God saved me from the ntcc because religion covers us in manure. The sickest part of the ntcc is the idolatry.
Jeremiah 17:5-6
Thus saith the LORD; Cursed be the man that trusteth in man, and maketh flesh his arm, and whose heart departeth from the LORD.
6For he shall be like the heath in the desert, and shall not see when good cometh; but shall inhabit the parched places in the wilderness, in a salt land and not inhabited.
Have a wonderful weekend!
Sometimes the stories that we told around the fellowship hall were just so stupid, they were funny!
There was a story floating around about the st.claire's and their long distance marathons. Apparently they were driving at night and they had another couple whose name I don't remember but it was the middle of the night and bro S. was driving. After awhile somebody in the back seat woke up at the rough and bumpy road.
When the person asked what was going on bro. S stopped the car and to his surprise he had gone out of the road and had been driving on the empty field near the highway. They turned around and saw the lights of the cars still on the highway!
Needless to say they all kept a watch on his driving after that.
Hey Guys, and Bro Johansen...
Hope all is well. These stories are shocking!! People falling asleep behind the wheel of cars just to make a church service. Wow! Curious to know what has happened to some of the ones that were around when I was with them, such as Perry Broadnax, Johnny Jordan, Paul Jordan, Bro Lorenzo Tucker just to name a few. Somebody let me know.
It's that time of year again. We're on the heels of another "best conference ever". Don't worry if you haven't purchased your airline tickets yet. You can drive and share the gas expense with another family of four and have the time of your lives. Just load up that Yugo and call it a marathon. You can make it from Graham to the campground in MO in 34 hours, if you only stop for bathroom and baloney sandwich breaks.
But if don't want to take the chance of getting in an accident, you can always take the Greyhound Bus, like that one pioneer pastor and his wife did. They told me you can ride all the way to Columbia, MO and hitchhike the rest of the way.
You can sleep in a cornfield if you haven't been wise with your 90% and are really short on cash. The weather is perfect for camping out this time of year. So have a great time, and don't forget to say hi to everyone for me.
Ha, ha. That was pretty funny. Maybe Kekel and Davis will preach at everyone for coming on this blog. Davis hates the internet. More people should post. Lot of readers but not that many posters. It's ok. Just keep reading and we'll keep writing.
Chiefy Wiefy
Anonymous,
You're right, conference time again. Did you know we have always been allowed to "spend time at the Camp when there is no Conference."
Also..."Lunch will be served each afternoon at the Dining Hall, (not free this time, but cheap) followed by a one-hour workshop."
http://www.myntcc.org/conference2011.html
I wonder if the 'workshops' are mandatory? If thy are, the only time you will be allowed to go out in town is early in the morning, or forgo an afternoon nap to go to Walmart.
If not mandatory, there will be no repercussions for non-compliance.
One of the things I really looked forward to was going out for lunch at the different local restaurants.
Gregory
Hey, everybody! Notice that they used a diamond for their promo pic. That's fitting because if there is anybody who knows about diamonds, it's that bunch. I think Tanya Keeeekel upgrades her diamonds about every 3 years or so.
How-bout that title "Approving all things honest" What a joke! That's exactly why so many people have left that crooked organization. We "disapproved of their dishonesty"!
What brazenness for them to use Philippians 1(10). Do they really think they are without offense?
Davis is not only an offense to the gospel, but a reproach to it. If he was to spend the rest of his days here on the earth making things right with the people that he has done wrong, he wouldn't have enough time left.
http://www.myntcc.org/conference2011.html
"There was a story floating around about the St.Claire's and their long distance marathons."
I remember Ralph and Joan from back in my days at the Tillicum Church over on SW Washington (I think) when I was at NTCC back in 78-79. at Fort Lewis. I had the opportunity to see them this last year when I was up there and had my visit with Mike Kekel with wife in tow. I really, genuinely like both of them and our conversation brought back many memories. I just hope that they will use better judgement in the future because neither one of them are spring chickens any longer.
This blog is working. Many people from a vast variety of locations are reading this blog.
Chief
Chief, where else would they get any news of their own church?
"Hey Guys, and Bro Johansen...
Hope all is well. These stories are shocking!! People falling asleep behind the wheel of cars just to make a church service. Wow! Curious to know what has happened to some of the ones that were around when I was with them, such as Perry Broadnax, Johnny Jordan, Paul Jordan, Bro Lorenzo Tucker just to name a few. Somebody let me know."
Wow, Victor Morton! How's it going? Dude, I still remember that Ghost pedal you gave to me--that touched my heart. I hated to have to sell it when we moved here to Fairbanks, but I sold all my drums and my vibraharp too. Ah well, the Lord has restored the drums and vibraharp that the NTCC locusts devoured.
Paul Jordan is still a functionary in the org, far as I know. Johnny Jordan split long ago and I've never heard his fate. I spoke with Lorenzo Tucker maybe six years ago; he was living in Bakersfield, California. I heard he joined up with Rony Denis and the House of Prayer after the split, although I think he had previously left NTCC, but I don't know if that's true. I've tried to track Perry down for years; far as I can tell he's back living in Reidsville, NC.
Speaking of falling asleep behind the wheel, I remember getting so out of it on the way to BS in St. Louis that I started hallucinating that there was a sheet of black plastic and a black revolver floating around outside the car. That was about the time I decided to pull over and crash out before I had a real crash.
Hope you're doing good. We're back living in Fairbanks; life is great. Battening down the hatches for the arctic winter.
It appears as though someone from Atlanta is reading this blog? Of course I used to live there so I wonder who? Don't matter. Chief
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