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The Rich Poor Church

Make sure you stop by the ATM before you enter your local NTCC. The third picture is P. Kinson or RWD about 20 years ago.

Rev 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:

This is the NTCC all the way. This describes the leaders of the NTCC. NTCC leaders are notorious for equating their financial prosperity to godliness and how wrong they are. The Bible has consistently warned of the dangers surrounding monetary gain and the NTCC leadership has selectively ignored such scriptures while highlighting scriptures supporting capitalism and prosperity. Well here are a few scriptures that RWD and Kekel prefer not to think about and I'm sure they also don't want to bring too much attention to the ones listed below. Such scriptures condemn Kekel and RWD.

1Tim 6:5 Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself.

Jeff said... RWD and Kekel teach that gain is godliness, at least as it justifies why they have wealth. They say that God gave it to them hence they justify their gain as a direct result of them being godly (so they say). I don't agree. A crook can gain wealth.

1Tim 6:9 But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition.

Jeff said... Are not RWD and Kekel rich?

1Tim 6:10 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

Jeff said... Do not RWD and Kekel love money. RWD said openly in conference that he prayed to God that he would become a "MILLIONAIRE". I heard him say this with my own ears.

Mat 19:23 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Jeff said... Once again, are not RWD and Kekel rich? Do these scriptures simply not apply to RWD and Kekel?

Mat 19:24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

Jeff said...

RWD and Kekel have taught (and I've heard them in conference) that God has blessed them because they can spiritually handle having money. They've taught that many people don't have money because God knows that having money would lead to their spiritual destruction. So in essence they've convinced their church that it is alright for them (RWD and Kekel) to be rich while it's not alright for you to be rich and in doing so they've effectively perpetuated one of the greatest con games that I've personally ever witnessed. They keep you poor (certainly in comparison to them) while at your expense they keep a constant flow of money heading straight in their direction. Oh it's not heading in their direction? The NTCC is a corporation and someone has control of all the money and assets or else the NTCC wouldn't have been able to donate as a gift 39 acres of land to Mike and Tanya Kekel valued at approx $373,000. Has RWD or the NTCC given you that much land? I didn't think so and you have no control of the NTCCs assets but they do and hence justification of my original statement. The money is heading in their direction. How many of you have $20,000 a year to put your child through a private academy like the Kekel's son? I rest my case. If there are others who fall in this category it's not many.

The problem is that the scriptures I highlighted above apply to the NTCC leadership just like they apply to everyone else. RWD and Kekel have taught that "GAIN IS EVIDENCE OF GODLINESS" and this teaching is in total contrast to 1Tim 6:5. None of these scriptures are prefaced by "except for NTCC leaders". Through deceit and greediness RWD and Kekel have blessed themselves while at the same time convincing the rest of the NTCC that it was God who blessed them. Crooks gain wealth everyday and God has always allowed it, but that doesn't mean it was God who blessed them.

The Catholic Church is the richest church in the world and I suppose all that wealth came from God? Creflo Dollar is rich as the day is long and I guess that is also evidence of Gods blessing in his life? What about all these other rich televangelists? I suppose according to the RWD and Kekel's logic God has blessed them also? Do you think that maybe the devil may have had something to do with it or simply their own greediness? So what you are telling me is that everyone else who has wealth got it without Gods intervention and totally on their own, but RWD and Kekel are the sole exceptions to the rule? Are you kidding me? I'm I expected to be that stupid? I used to be but not anymore. RWD, Kekel, Jones, Ramirez are all prosperity preachers; no more and no less. They are not one bit different than Creflo Dollar and the Bishop Eddie Long. Their teaching is simple and it's this: If you give the NTCC money, you will be blessed. So if that is the case then why is it that virtually no one else in the NTCC has houses and land as grand as Kekel and RWD? Maybe Kinson? Maybe Ashmore? Maybe Olson, Gezang, or Johnson? I don't know you tell me but what about the rest. How come money hasn't dropped from Gods unlimited supply like they've promised? Who else in the NTCC is living in a mansion like RWD?

RWD and Kekel are not exceptions to the Bible rule and according to the Bible they've also fallen into perdition; 1Tim 6:9. God is not going to give them a bi and make an exception to his Bible rules just for their sake. They've got you NTCCers tricked or you've also decided that building churches (with one of the main focuses being the accumulation of wealth) suits your fancy also. If RWD is so interested in the accumulation of wealth, (which he is) and he wants the same for you, (which he claims) then why doesn't RWD have all his ministers go out and start their very own churches just like he did? When I say "their very own" I mean a church where all the funds that funnel into that church stay in that church and the Pastor of that church is directly responsible for and has control over all of it. RWD doesn't suggest that because then his organization wouldn't be getting a piece of everyone else's pie if you all went and started your very own independent church. You all better read the rest of your Bible or you are going to wind up going through your entire life tricked by RWD and Kekel's scam while giving them all your hard earned cash. The NTCC is definitely a very good example of the Laodicean Church found in Revelation Chapter 3.

Think about it folks.

Jeff

Looks Like The NTCC Tried To Lay Down The Law

I received a phone call last night that I returned late this morning from an individual who lives near Graham Washington and is currently attending services with with NTCC and has been for quite a few years. What this person told me is really nothing new but it was nevertheless good to get it straight from yet another credible source.

This person was in conference when RWD paraded a minister who I believe was Devonshire in front of the entire congregation to flaunt his (available for a wife status). The individual who called me had remained alarmed for quite some time about the incident. This person thought that the escapade was totally inappropriate especially being that everyone knew the mans wife. This person also told me of additional occurrence that took place during a conference in Washington within approximately the last year when Kekel declared that it has never been a problem for an NTCC member to attend secular colleges or universities as long as the school didn't interfere with someones service to the Lord.

That is an outright lie for Kekel to make such a statement. Kekel is an outright liar and a crook. Anyone who might have even considered sending their child to a secular college would have been labeled as someone who didn't have their family in subjection and therefor wasn't qualified to lead a church if they couldn't lead their children to the NTCCs school of rules. I've heard that kind of stuff over and over again while attending NTCC services. It was also taught that if a person was soul winning, visiting people, having a full schedule of church services, praying and studying their bible, they wouldn't have time to attend a quote, "worldly secular college" and if they didn't understand that they needed to "get saved". It was taught by the NTCC leadership consisting of RWD, his overseers and his pastors that in the grand scheme of Gods eternal, spiritual agenda, (a worldly secular college) would be of virtually little or no "eternal" benefit what so ever. My recollection isn't vague but quite accurate and once again Kekel is deceitful.

The person I talked to also said that Kekel spoke of it never being a problem for people in the NTCC to be involved with organized sports and that from his chair next to the pulpit RWD piped in with, "quit saying Davis said". Apparently Kekel brought up the subject because people (rightfully so) had been complaining about Kekel's kid playing in all these high school sports while wearing shorts and tight football pants when they knew that RWD had verbally forbidden such conduct for years and years. So because people had been saying that they remembered RWD verbally stating his opposition to such sports participation, RWD decided to pipe in with "quit saying that Davis said". We all know that Davis and his pastors taught that sports participation and secular colleges were a waste of a Christians time and they would better serve God if they went, "soul winning", or went "visiting new potential converts", or went to "yet another church service", or "went into the ministry as a FULL TIME pastor" having previously attended the NTCCs school of rules otherwise know as the Bible college. Folks who didn't agreed with this stance heard over the pulpit that they "needed to get saved".

We all know these things were taught by RWD and his pastors and overseers and it is flat out INSULTING and INFURIATING for Kekel to suggest otherwise as though we all have poor recollection and memory or that we are all simply stupid while not possessing the mental capacity to read between the lines. I've concluded that all NTCC ministers (who sat through that conference and decided to stay with the NTCC) are inherently crooked because they must be after having listened to all that garbage while knowing it is was an outright lie.

Words can not express the degree of disdain that many of us now have for the NTCC leadership as a result of their deceitful, disingenuous and untruthful conduct. Kekel and RWD and Olson are outright liars and can in no wise be considered what the Bible refers to as "CHRISTIANS". Many, many people who heard this stuff preached, and who sat through NTCC services are my witnesses, and God himself is my witness for he knows what RWD and his pastors previously taught for decades. I stand behind this blog and boldly stand against the NTCC leaderships hypocrisy and I will gladly talk to anyone who contests my statements or anyone who also wants to discuss the NTCCs deceitful leadership.

The first cat picture to the far left is the dude who just finished running for his life, from a brainwashed NTCC minister who just tried to run it over with his automobile. The second one is the nice little fellow who miraculously escaped the well of water that an NTCC pastor used to try and drown the poor fellow. The third picture is of your very own house cat buddy who haphazardly wandered in the wrong NTCC pastors back yard only to find bullets flying at him which were shot by a crazed, brainwashed NTCC pastor exiting his back door. Why do I make such claims. Just read below while I refute an anonymous posters statement.

In a previous thread, Anonymous wrote:

"And no cats are not evil that was one mans dislike turned into a doctrine. That is crazy and it is not NTCC doctrine."

Jeff said...

I wanted to continue with this subject. Anon said that it is not NTCC doctrine. Well I say; that depends on what you consider "doctrine". Here are real dictionary definitions for the word "doctrine".

1. a particular principle, position, or policy taught or advocated, as of a religion or government: Catholic doctrines; the Monroe Doctrine.
2. something that is taught; teachings collectively: religious doctrine.
3. a body or system of teachings relating to a particular subject: the doctrine of the Catholic Church.

Jeff said...

The practice of hating and KILLING cats was "taught and advocated" by the NTCC hence fitting the dictionary definition of the word "doctrine". I can emphatically state that as fact while quantifying my stance.

One very respected and highly regarded NTCC pastor personally told me the he and other brothers would drown cats in a well of water. He laughed about this fact quite gleefully.

Another NTCC pastor who is still with the NTCC pastoring in Washington told me that he watched a brother drive his vehicle erratically in an attempt to run down, run over, and kill a cats who was "running" from the cars path. When the pastor told me this he also laughed with utter glee while showing an emotional display of much pleasure concerning the subject of "killing cats".

Yet another different NTCC pastor refused to allow his daughter over to my house to play with my daughter, (who was about the same age and who incidentally had come to my house to play on previous occasions) because we got my daughter a pet kitty cat. This pastor said that my wife and I didn't spiritually understand the nature of cats and his daughter could no longer come to play with our daughter until we got rid of the cat.

The NTCC pastor who would drown cats in a well of water told me that cats were evil and RWD taught that the cat was essentially kin to the snake because they both had slit pupils in their eyes which made them essentially evil animals dating all the way back to Eve being beguiled by the serpent in the garden of eden. Now I'm not making this stuff up.

Additionally it has been reported that an NTCC minister walked out his back door and began shooting at a cat in his back yard with a real gun and I have no reason to doubt this claim due to my personal experiences with cat hating NTCC preachers.

Yet another, different NTCC pastor preached against animal lovers as a whole, for almost an entire service, which I had the displeasure of sitting through. This guy absolutely went nuts on his tirade against animals and animal lovers. My wife and I never went back to his church which was the first NTCC church of two we visited in Atlanta Georgia.

So with all these different NTCC pastors sharing the same basic beliefs about cats I'm supposed to believe that it wasn't taught hence qualifying as a doctrine? You mean to tell me that I, Jeffrey Collins just circumstantially and by pure chance happened to come in contact with the only 3 or 4 cat hating NTCC pastors in the entire NTCC? You're kidding right?

NO, hating cats was common for pastors in the NTCC. That is the only logical explanation and the practice was CLEARLY TAUGHT.

The NTCC is FULL of a bunch of KOOKS, who are being misled by someone even KOOKIER, and Anonymous has been deceived into believing otherwise. How many weird, nutty, kooky NTCC TRUE stories do I and others have to write about before folks realize they are involved in a truly messed up organization absolutely FULL of brainwashed and mislead preachers. If you think I'm making up any of this cats stuff please call me and we can discuss the subject.

NTCC: Cult Or Not? Are There Any Churches That Wouldn't In Some Way Match One Of The Text Book Definitions Of A Cult?

The NTCC is a church which is full of little Kitty Cat haters. They think that Cats are evil.

Thread #29 I am starting a new thread because this topic has been going pretty strong on the previous thread, and Dawn has quite appropriately reminded me that there are more effective ways to sift through a blog than to read 100 posts under the exact same thread. Dawn is right so here we go. I said that for two reasons: Number one because Dawn was in fact right and number two because I want folks to know that I will rapidly act on suggestions from blog participants. I will seriously consider all suggestions from all parties as they pertain to the betterment of this blog.

Now back to the cult thread. I am going to be my own devils advocate here for a moment. I have looked up the definition of a cult and posted it on the previous thread. I also gave examples of how the NTCCs practices very closely mirror the text book definitions of a cult. Guess what; in all fairness to the NTCC; teachings in the Bible also very closely mirror the text book definitions of a cult. As a result many churches could be considered a cult so I posted this question on the previous thread. Are all cults bad? Also why do we think the NTCC is a "bad" cult. I know why I think the NTCC is a bad cult. I specified my reasons on the previous thread.

Concerned NTCC Minister wrote this and I quote: In regard to the fact that many of these attributes seem to match up, I would just like to ask all thinking individuals to consider the fact that these attributes also match many other organizations, including the government.

Jeffs response: I try my best to be a fair and honest broker of this blog. Concerned NTCC Minister is absolutely right and I offer no "buts" or apologies. Some NTCC folks may want to consider taking a few pointers from Concerned Minister. In my opinion, he has more effectively represented the NTCC than anyone who has posted on Factnet or any of the rest of these blogs. I may not always agree with him, which I don't, but often I can't refute the mans statements nor do I want to when he offers only pure logic in a respectful manner. I would like to have the man over to my house for dinner and if you think I am kidding, I'm not. I don't hate NTCC folks. I just can't stand the abuse, the double standards and worse than both of those, THE DENIAL.

Oh and I can't stand most of their absurd rules which is the main reason I think the NTCC is a bad cult. It is called unorthodox extremism. Teaching that Cats are evil is extreme and certainly unorthodox. Having an adult stand against a wall so they can ask permission to date some one, is unorthodox, extreme, and a rule that could have only been dreamed up by a control freak, who runs his church like a "BAD" cult.

Jeff

Nuttir Than A Fruit Cake

Boy does Mike ever have an obsession with facebook participants. He just started a new thread called the Facebook / MySpace Psalm. What a joke! What in the world is going on with this guy? He might be loosing it. Wasn't Mike the guy who masqueraded as the "Whirlwind" on Factnet a few years back? Yes he was so it seems to me he is continuing full speed ahead with the old double standard. His blog is no more than an exNTCCer hater blog anyway so he doesn't have any room to critique anyone else's internet habits the way I see it. I don't particularly like the word, "hater" but I thought it was appropriate being that so many NTCC folks like to liberally throw it around.

Even though he is a hypocrite, I really don't blame Mike for firing back at exNTCCers like myself. I've been firing at him with both barrels blazing for a good while now so can you blame the guy for at least making a feeble attempt at defending himself?

Anyway, his obsession with facebook is no more than damage control NTCC style. Mike is smart enough to realize that folks will continue to escape the NTCC, (more so than they've already been) as they learn more about the org's secrets. Facebook is an avenue to such information because ex-ers are on facebook. The NTCC's greatest trick has always been maintaining control of the flow of information. That fact alone is singlehandedly responsible for the creation of so many NTCC rules. They've never wanted folks to talk that much so they've prohibited churches from intermingling for reasons other then organized fellowship meetings. They required that couples ask permission to even go to each others houses. They've wanted to limit the number of kids that attend each others birthday parties. The list goes on.

Well the internet has put a halt to all this control freak, information censorship business and now Mike has come almost completely undone with this facebook obsession of his. Just look at his last thread and tell me I'm lying. A facebook psalm? Ha!!!! He is becoming nuttier than a fruit cake. How do NTCC people take this guy serious. He may be a serious musician. I don't doubt that. He may have decent to above average organizational skills. I don't doubt that either. What I do doubt is that he is even remotely qualified to guide folks spiritually. People have dedicated their whole life to the NTCC which is now being guided by a guy like him?

If I was looking for some spiritual guidance I would be better off jumping in a lake and talking to a fish. Hey, the fish might be the 50th cousin, 5 times removed from one of those dudes that got caught in the net when Christ told Peter to cast it off the right side of the ship. At least with the fish I'd have a remote chance at some real spiritual guidance. A facebook Psalm? You GOT to be kidding me? This is the guy that NTCC folks are following? Boy am I glad I didn't wind up in Graham. LOL. ROTFL. The blind leading the blind.

Jeff

Rev 2:6 - But this thou hast, that thou hatest the deeds of the Nicolaitanes, which I also hate

Reposted from a previous thread with some editing by Jeff.

April wrote...

I read Mike K. labeling me and many others as Haters! Those of us that have escaped the cult as haters.
I have tried to push that aside and say no, I do not Hate these men and women that controlled my life for 13 years! I tried to reassure many that I am not bitter, not angry, hold hateful feelings for them. I know those feelings are not Christ like. Though I am sure Christ has serious righteous anger for these people and the treatment they have doled out to his children!

As I am learning and really trying to accept the past, I do hate the life that I lived in NTCC. I hate for the financial situation we were in while in Bible school and out in the ministry. You really could not get ahead and raise a family UNLESS you becamse the harsh dictators that NTCC wants you to be. I hate that I was not able to grieve for my Grandfather, my Great Aunt or my Grandmother. I lost about five close family members while in NTCC and did not attend ONE of their funerals. Going home during Bible school was not a option. We could barely scrap up the money for the tuition, pay the babysitter, tithe, offerings for MANY service's a week, gas for the vehicle etc. I lost my Grandfather one month before a conference. I was Denied being able to go home. If I did, I would have LOST that entire semester. So I stayed in WA and went to that conference and did squezze out a short visit but when you go home, (which is very rare) you don't want to spend that time crying. You do not know when the next time you will be there to see them, or who you might lose inbetween visits. So yes, I do hate that I tried to grieve alone.

What is now happening since leaving ntcc. It all hits you at once. BAMB! That depression of losing loved one's, those lost years, those things you said or not did. Then your left to make decisions on your own that can be fearful. It was all decided for US! Now I am learning to rely on God, leaning on him for guidance. Before I never understood being a Christian. I even have trouble with that word, Christian. I see it still to much with NTCC and not as it should be seen as something special.

I hate that I became a zombie who could not think on my own. That women were supposed to be bubble head ninnies. Not many of them read a newspaper or pay attention to world affairs. Can't even hold a conversation about tough topics. It's like before women VOTED. Oh that is too much for your pretty little head; WOMAN!

I hate for how I treated my BLOOD family. Cut them off. Bashed them as sinners. I am learning things I said to my loved one's. I can not even remember saying. And I cry for those things I said,and have no recolection of doing it.

I hate how my marriage was rushed; no dating and got married in about five months time. Used to take pride in that while in the cult. I was relieved that I never had to sit on that gawd awful WALL! I am just now getting to know my husband. It almost broke up my marriage because we have many different interests. Most couples do, but in NTCC all of us had different interests. We were the same, did the same things, listed to the same music, hair styles the same, bought similar dresses, shoes, purses. ALL OF US WERE THE SAME ROBOTS! Now I am allowed to be myself and still stay saved as a Christian.

Me, I have never Hated a person in my life. I just can't say I hate RW Davis or hate MC Kekel, or T Kekel etc. I do HATE what they do to people's live's and I hate that they twist the scripture, the mind control that goes on, the double talking. I hate the false teachings and the spirit behind their actions. It is NOT OUT OF LOVE! I know; I never felt LOVE by those people. I FEARED them. I avoided RW Davis and MC Kekel. To go and call him for permission made me sweat. I did not want to get on the phone and ask another adult for permission. My own mother gave me more responsiblity then this so called Bible school!

So if there going to call us "Haters", then that is what I HATE!
I will pray for these people, that their eyes will be open to the hurt they have caused and the damage that they have caused. Their hands are covered with the Blood of many souls!

April Michalik

Jeff said...

I can relate.

Jeff

The Blogs And The NTCCs Inability To Cover-up The Facts

I thought it was interesting how this hit counters recent visitors map suddenly shifted from all over the U.S. to a much more centralized region somewhere around the middle Missouri area. Imagine that. Couldn't be because of conference hey? I just can't imagine that many NTCC folks essentially betraying Mike and the good old org just to read my ex-er hater blog. It certainly would seem to be the case if you've followed my good old hit counter.

Maybe Mike and old RWD don't have quite the grip on those folks that they'd prefer? I wonder how many folks Mike and RWD ran off this conference? There has been a little pressure on the org with the Shunks starting a blog and the reporter hanging around.

Come on. You've got to admit that it is a weird mind set for all these guys who are trying to marry off their teen age daughters to do no more than live a life of poverty and struggle. Folks need to stop trying to be so spiritual and see things for what they really are. The NTCC has got you duped. My daughter is going to college. Do you think Mikes son will be doing any different? Time will tell won't it. I may very well be wrong but based on the Kekels history I somehow doubt it. Can you blame them? I may not care for Mike but he ain't no dummy. You think he is going to send his son through the NTCS? If he does he will sure prove me wrong but I highly doubt it.

It's probably going to go something like this. Someone is going to come on any number of different blogs and complain about how Kekel's son is attending a secular college after they were guilt tripped into sending their child through the NTCS. Then Mike is going to start a thread about folks not "listening" and misinterpreting what RWD has been putting out for years. Then he'll say he prayed about it and it seemed good to the Lord that GK attend Duke or Yale or a Military Academy or something like that. Then he will say that everyone else who "thought" their child had to attend the NTCS were no more than a bunch of knot heads.

Jeff

The False Prophet

Mike Kekel wrote this statement on his blog...

"I remember a certain prayer meeting at old Forest Ave., where I was down at the altar. We were all praying in the dimly lit chapel and God was moving; Debbie Blumenthal was right on the other side, praying in tongues. We were pouring our hearts out, and I noticed her sincerity most of all. I still believe she had something from God."

Jeff wrote...

Mike wrote quite a bit during his tirade toward Greg Shunk. The particular part above, highlighted in red, really caught my attention. I'm guessing that many people overlooked that small portion of his long statement, but it really stood out to me as a testament to Mike Kekel's character and psyche.

The first thing it tells me is that Mike has quite a high opinion of himself. Overblown to say the least. I wonder why Mike is so naive that he quite obviously seems to believe that he should actually be considered some kind of spiritual critic just because he married the big guy's daughter? The second thing it tells me is that Mike considers himself some kind of spiritual analyst. What qualifies Mike to make determinations concerning whether or not someone had quote, "something from God"? The fact that his father in law has systematically promoted him to head honcho henchman of the NTCC? I'm no spiritual guru and don't claim to be, but I doubt that Mike has quote "something from God". Mike wouldn't be in that position if he hadn't married the corporate head's daughter. So because RWD gave Mike preferential treatment, that qualifies him to be some kind of spiritual analyst? I don't think so and hence the title of this thread. The false prophet. That title fits him more suitably.

According to about 40 years of NTCC standards, Kekel is about as worldly as they get. So what you have is an egotistical, pomps, dude that is fooling himself and he works hard to learn how to attempt to fool others. I'm not fooled. Mike Kekel is no more qualified to evaluate Deb Shunk's former spiritual condition than I am to evaluate the structural rigidity of the golden gate bridge. Mike Kekel may have put in many hours in an attempt to continually control folks lives but we all know that didn't get him to the position he is in. His daddy in law did; plain and simple, and anyone who thinks differently can be the first to test out the strength of the bridge that I'm getting ready to build.

The next issue. Mike wrote...

"He began to obsess about what would happen to his wife if he died, would the church support her. No NTCC answer was given to such a foolish and unlearned question."

Jeff wrote...

What on Gods green earth is so quote "foolish and unlearned" about that question? Mike Kekel is living in the wonderland that has been prepared by his daddy in law so he is unable and unsuitable to even attempt to relate with such a concern. The NTCC is not even interested in taking care of widows so to Mike that would be a foolish question but to Greg who didn't get handed a silver spoon that is a legitimate concern. It's a legitimate concern for me also and I decided that I would no longer put any faith in the NTCC leadership because the only folks they are worried about taking care of is themselves. Even after they've ran you into the ground. It's good to know that Mike thinks it's foolish and unlearned for someone to be concerned about their wives well being.

How is Sis Espinoza doing? I rest my case. She certainly ain't living like the Kekels but I forgot, that was all her husbands fault, right? You know that she had to go find a job and all, getting paid probably around minimum wage? Foolish and unlearned hey? As usual what a bunch of garbage.

Jeff

Now You Have The Rest Of The Story

On Mike Kekel's blog Mike Kekel wrote...

"**No April,that is a fallacy. We maintain accurate records of the monthly support sent to Missionaries, and none of them have ever been forgotten. If you are referring to Casey Hayes and some of the things he said on Jeff Collins' Blog, no wonder. He wasn't forgotten, he was receiving support from the org AND WORKING a job, and still told everyone he was starving there. He tried to push the Cespedes' into "upgrading" their life and spending money on better furniture, criticizing their things, while he was moving to the "highlands" and putting his kids in the nicest music schools, etc. He NEVER got a building, never started a church, in all those years. The other Bro and Sis didn't get that, so they started their own thing and had a building, services and people in a few months. Casey Hayes stayed there in Puerto Rico for a few more years, and only went to their services ONCE. He wouldn't even go to church with them. He was flying to Florida with the boss, and golfing, etc. So now, how is that NTCC's fault? He should have been cut off really, but who knew? When he got back here, he told me he'd never seen such an outpouring of love. He posted to Collins' Blog that he saw NO love. Uh..? When the support money ran out, (money raised from NTCC people for Casey's endeavors,) it went red to the tune of 40k, just to keep it going. Now someone doesn't know what they are saying. What you call NTCC Fog, is the clouds that you see, and we're up above them in the sunshine."

Jeff responded with facts....

I talked to Casey Hayes and found out that some of what Mike Kekel wrote about him was ABSOLUTE lies. Now there are four possible options here. Either Mike Kekel willfully wrote an outright lie, or Mike Kekel was told an outright lie, or the story became an outright lie after it became completely distorted due to the grape vine, or Mike Kekel's recollection absolutely stinks and through simple minded ignorance he tells outright lies. Which ever the case, Mike Kekel wrote absolute falsehoods i.e. lies about Casey Hayes.

I asked Casey FOUR times if he played Golf in Florida and he absolutely said NO. I asked Casey so many times that it almost became insulting to him. I literally questioned him because I wanted true facts and I listened very carefully to his answers. He said that he never played golf even one time during the entire time he was in Puerto Rico or anywhere else say no less Florida. Casey simply did not play golf during the entire time-frame which was referenced by Mike Kekel so what Mike Kekel wrote was an an outright lie.

Casey also said that he suggested to the Cespedes that they "DIDN'T" spend their money, not the other way around so that was also an outright lie. He said that he suggested that they hold on to their money because it was expensive to live in Puerto Rico. Mike got that one completely backwards. Mike said that Casey had his children in the quote "nicest" music schools and Casey said that that his daughter was in a public school that taught music and the school was absolutely free unlike the school that Grant Kekel goes to at a cost of approximately $20,000 a year. You want to talk about the pot calling the kettle black.

Mike Kekel said that the Cespedes got a building and services started but what Mike didn't tell you is that the Cespedes showed up to Puerto Rico with well over $10,000 at their disposal. According to Casey the amount reported to him was $14,000 that the Cespedes showed up with but don't take that to the bank because if the amount was actually $14,175 then Mike Kekel would get all rapped up with semantics and say that Casey was a liar so just know that the Cespedes showed up with a bunch of money that Casey Hayes didn't have. Therefore it shouldn't come as any surprise that the Cespedes were able to "AFFORD" a building. I don't know if the money was their own money or given by the NTCC, but the fact is that they reported to Casey that they showed up with about $14,000 US Dollars.

If you know Casey Hayes you know that he is one of the most happy go lucky guys that you will ever meet and he is very easy to get along with and Casey said that the Cespedes didn't even want to fellowship with Casey and his family so naturally Casey didn't want anything to do with them either. This next part is part speculation but I'm convinced that the NTCC leadership no doubt told the Cespedes that Casey was considered by them to be a dead beat so it comes as no surprise that the Cespedes showed up to Puerto Rico with a chip on their shoulder under the notion that they were sent there to save the day.

The NTCC is full of ministers that according to their controlling standards never did anything for God but the people they slander and smear are the ones who have left. Oberhauser received a congregation from Hunt of approximately 70 - 80 people or more and Oberhauser successfully knocked the congregation down to about 10 or less because of his lack of leadership skills while listening to Briggs poor guidance. I don't see Kekel starting a thread to discredit him? If he left the NTCC and had anything bad to say about the leadership then Kekel would slam him also. Tell me I'm lying? The only people who Mike writes about by name in a negative manner are the people who leave!!!! Go figure that one. Now you got the "Rest Of The Story".

Kekel simply wrote lies. Much of what Mike wrote wasn't even half truths and the majority of what remained was little more at best then a half truth. The only thing he wrote that was true is that Casey wasn't successful at building a church. Well join the club because that ain't no strange occurrence in the NTCC. Casey wanted to go to Connecticut in the first place anyway and RWD wouldn't have it because Casey had family that lived in the area. If the NTCC leadership wasn't so lousy they wouldn't have sent Casey there in the first place. Casey had been with the NTCC for about 20 years and they hadn't figured out yet that he wasn't some super pioneer church builder? Casey is one of my best friends but it is what it is and that is not an insult. The NTCC leadership dropped the ball on that one so they shouldn't blame their placement error on anyone but themselves. Oh I almost forgot; I thought it was God who told RWD to send Casey there in the first place. I guess God is the one who messed up. RWD better stop asking God where to send his people because in the case of Casey Hayes, according to Mike Kekel a mistake must have been made.

Get some of that Mikey and I didn't get it from the old devil either. You make the devil a whole lot more happy than I do. The devil wishes that I would shut down this blog because he likes the fact that you guys are misleading so many people with all your kooky rules that we are regularly exposing right here. We are messing up the devils game. I took that page right out of your NTCC super spiritual rhetoric book.

Jeff

Even More From The Dispatch

Don't let your eyes get too wide with this one but when I thought I'd seen it all, yet another good article has been written by Bruce at "The Dispatch". Justice is slow but it's sure.

Here is the link below. By all means leave your comments at The Dispatch if you want to add anything to the good article which has been written by Bruce.

It's amazing what a little persistence can accomplish when the right people put their nose to the mission. It is nice to taste the fruit of our labors and we can accomplish a lot when we work together. The NTCC could divert much or all of this negative publicity if their leaders would suck up their pride and apologize for all the hurt they've caused so many. I expect that is unlikely to happen.

http://www.dispatchnews.com/main.asp?Search=1&ArticleID=2578&SectionID=6&SubSectionID=6&S=1

Jeff

True Racism At It's Best Coming Directly To You From The Church Behind The Fence

Abraham Lincoln would be very unhappy about this one. I thought this type of racist conduct was on the way out the door and especially in churches, but hardly is the case where the NTCC is concerned.

Monique Navarro wrote...

I would like to confirm that what John D. stated about comments made about African Americans over the pulpit is correct. I am African American myself and have often heard racist comments being made about Blacks. Many of us have personally seen him make monkey gestures during one of his sermons as he stated that "hip hop music is "monkey music." I have also heard negative comments being made about African American women wearing braids and about mixed marriages. I have had a questionable experience in which a church member noticing my grandparents nice home asked how a "nigger got a house like that?"

When I brought this issue to Rev. Kekel's attention it was swept under the rug. He made it appear as if I was the one in the wrong. He personally told me that, "I shouldn't have gotten offended." He would just tell people that I had heart issues.

Sir we can't all be wrong. There are way too many in agreement that have left NTCC. Honestly sir, it looks to me like the only one with a heart issue is Rev. Kekel himself. I believed that this man loved me and my family. He destroyed my belief in him and in their organization. I and my family have since left. We are attending a new church where we are valued. God knows that what many are saying is true and we are not just "bitter people looking for revenge." What would be the point in doing that? That would be fruitless. Many of us are hoping to spare others a "look behind the fence". We that have left all know what goes on behind the fence and it isn't pretty. Save yourself the gas, the time and the money and don't bother visiting this church.

Jeff said...

As usual that is another "Real Story" about life in the NTCC. I suppose this lady is lying as well. Do you think? I copied this excerpt from "The Dispatch" and pasted it here on this blog. A link to the dispatch can be found in the thread immediately below. This is yet another example of one of the many reasons why I left the NTCC and why this blog exists. The NTCC leadership "OWES" folks some serious apologies with Monique not being the least of which who's deserving one. Unfortunately it will probably never happen. All fancy rhetoric aside; it really is sad when this type of conduct exists in what is supposed to be a Christian church. The NTCC leadership should be ashamed while making dire attempts to rectify and fix this highly unhealthy and hurtful situation that clearly exists within their corporation / organization.

Jeff

More From The Dispatch

Below is link to the second article about the NTCC printed in "The Dispatch", a South Pierce County Washington news paper. Looks like old Bruce (who wrote the article) took a heat round from Phil Kinson while attending service with the NTCC. That is a typical NTCC tactic and it's childish. Phil took Bruce's presents as an opportunity to take a cheap shop at journalists. I've seen NTCC pastors use that tactic so many times that it is utterly sickening. So I suppose that's how to win folks to Christ? What a joke is all I can say.

The next article will address folks opinion of the NTCC as a cult and I'm interested to see what is written.

http://www.dispatchnews.com/main.asp?SectionID=6&SubSectionID=6&ArticleID=2569&TM=63829.67

Jeff

EXTRA, EXTRA, READ ALL ABOUT IT!

Here is another chance to get the word out about what the NTCC is really all about. An article about the NTCC has been written in "The Dispatch", (A South Pierce County Washington Newspaper). At the bottom of the article is an "Article Comment Submission Form" that will allow you to voice your feelings about the NTCC. I think this a good thing however we will see. Attached below is a link.

http://www.dispatchnews.com/main.asp?Search=1&ArticleID=2556&SectionID=6&SubSectionID=6&S=1

Some folks have already posted their comments and I believe the word is getting out. Many of us know that the NTCC is a destructive cult who's primary goal it to control peoples lives so they can gain control of their money. The NTCC has always hated publicity because they have a whole bunch of bones that they don't want to have let out of the closet. This newspaper will certainly get the word out to the Pierce county residents. What the newspaper editor leaves out we can include by submitting our comments. The most important types information we can add are known facts. True, first hand testimonies will open the eyes people more than non quantifiable jargon such as the NTCC being a cult. Yes that is true but why is the NTCC a cult. I included some facts with my submission. The train is slow folks but I believe we are making progress. The NTCC has done much irreversible damage to the lives of many people and the word needs to continue to get out.

On a side note. Soon I'm going to visit my Mom and it's good not only to have the time, (because it won't be wasted on yet another blow hard conference) but I no longer feel the need to explain my itinerary to some narcissistic, control monger of an NTCC pastor. Thank God that he woke me up long enough to see that those days needed to be over.

Jeff Collins

A Concerned Mom

A few days ago I received a call from a woman who was concerned that her son had gotten involved with HOP. She had been reading this blog, Debs blog, factnet, and other websites which expose the NTCC. She was able to conclude that HOP was no more than a branch of the NTCC. The HOP leadership has brainwashed her son into believing that his Mom is being used by the devil and as a result he very rarely goes to visit her. As usual he believes and tells her that she is quote, "not saved" or right with God, and that she essentially doesn't understand what Christianity is all about. This young guy believes that Denis is some kind of prophet. Needless to say the HOP has this young man quite mixed up and thoroughly confused. Of course he doesn't see it that way and it is such a shame. The Mom is quite heart broken over the whole situation and I don't blame her.

This isn't the first time that I've received a call from a concerned Mom who's son has got all mixed up with either HOP or the NTCC. I see the two organizations as equally destructive, one being no better or worse than the other. If I could consider one organization worse I would definitely say it would be the NTCC because RWD molded and formed Denis and therefor RWD created HOP with his own wicked example.

This Concerned Mom didn't know which way to turn so she contacted me with the hope that I could provide her with some helpful information. The sad part is I don't know if I was able to help her at all? I was going to take a shot at talking to her Son but if I did that, the effects could potentially wind up far more negative than positive. The woman's son could possibly decide to thoroughly alienate his mom then, (more so than he already has) because of course he would know that she gave me his phone number. I can't really divulge much more of the conversation we had because if I did, I would risk revealing his moms identity and consequently risk doing more damage to an already shaky relationship between the Mom and her Son.

Churches like this are so destructive, but it's seems apparent that the majority of them are here to stay. Many cults have been around for a long time and I'm sure they've done as much damage to good loving families as the NTCC or HOP. I know this blog has helped folks see the light and I may never see the doors of the NTCC shut but I can surely reduce the traffic that goes in those doors while causing an increase to the number of people who walk out of those doors never to return.

I hope this mom's son will see the light sooner than later and leave HOP for good.

Jeff